Personal Ideas for Darius.

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Reathien

Senior Member

09-09-2012

I have a few personal ideas that could be applied to Darius, just simple things.

Idea 1. Changes to his passive:
Change his passive to physical damage, that seems like a pretty logical idea, he does physical damage with every other ability save his ult, which is true damage.
On top of this, have his passive changed to be applied on the next auto attack after using an ability (A Sheen effect), and changing his Crippling Strike to apply stacks of Hemorrhage, since it is an auto attack. It would stop darius from being able to blow all his abilities and nuke a champion, aswell as opening different build paths by making CDR a nice looking stat. The plain fact is his ult does 20% more damage per stack of hemorrhage and it does alot of damage, it should in no way be easy to apply, aswell since your ult is only usable at level 6 you should have all your abilities, making it no problem to apply the stacks.

Idea 2: Change to Apprehend.
Apprehend at the moment is a ok spell, but the passive effect on it is quite overkill. 25% armor penetration with a last whisper(40% armor Penetration) and the mastery(10%) is 75% armor penetration, leaving any amount of armor drastically reduced. 200 armor is now 50, 100 is now 25, 300 is a lowly 75, which puts him with having great damage from his abilities without needing to stack an amazing amount of attack damage. This in mind it should be reduced or removed. However that would be unfair to outright remove something without reimbursing them. In place i believe there should be a damage component to apprehend, something like 30(+30 per rank[150 base damage at rank 5]) +Base attack damage( 50ad+3.5per level leave him with +113 damage, 263 total damage at rank 5 and level 18) and +1/3 of bonus AD.
With a level 18 base of 263 damage and a third of your bonus AD it will give you a little more AOE presence while reducing the single target bursting that darius can dish out.

Idea 3: The most obvious change.
Reduce the bonus hemorrhage gives to Noxian Guillotine. Quite simple, it gets a .75 ad ratio and a high amount of base damage. Rank 1 is 160 true damage, a fair amount at level 6, but with 5 stacks of hemorrhage it suddenly turns into 320 damage +1.5 damage per bonus AD, which is ALOT of true damage at such a low level.
My idea is simple enough, cut the base AD scaling and hemorrhage boost. Change Hemorrhage to provide 10% increased damage, max +50% and reduce the base AD scaling to .5. At level 6 the base damage would be 160, with a cap of 240 +0.75 AD scaling(With 5 stacks of hemorrhage). Likewise rank 2 would be 325 max base damage, and rank 3 would be 510 base damage. Not to much of a change, just rewards building more attack damage with higher damage, but makes it not to strong if all you build is tank items.

Idea 4: Halfway ok idea.
Not the strongest idea, but changing Noxian Guillotine to have NO base damage and scale off attack damage as a whole. Thus, a straight tank Darius is going to have low low damage on his ult, while a full AD darius with 300-400 AD will have a 600-800 damage ult.

These ideas are just my own, i think they could work, its not that darius is OP, its that he just gets too much reward from building tanky than he should. Any constructive criticism would be nice.


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X74

Senior Member

09-09-2012

Leave LoL forever.


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Reathien

Senior Member

09-09-2012

You could try pointing out the flaws in my ideas instead of telling me to leave the game forever. I doubt anyone actually good at this game would be that childish.


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Folly Inc

Senior Member

09-09-2012

Hemorrhage is magical damage for a reason. It's there to be countered by Hexdrinker, which is a very strong top lane item. If it gets changed to physical damage you falsely encourage players to build armor to counter, in which he continues to improve his already strong armor penetration. So Idea 1 is pretty much scrapped because changing it to attack damage would make him stronger. In addition, making hemorrhage stack only on auto-attacks used after skills ensures that he will -never- have five stacks of hemorrhage, thereby making the champion worthless.

Idea two, again you're removing what makes Darius a champion, and turning him into another champion easily countered by armor. It's his ability to deal consistent damage over the entire game that makes him a champion, not his ability to become useless late game by the 2-3 armor stackers on the team. Any good Darius will put his points into armor penetration as he needs it, just to ensure that he IS dealing damage, and not just bouncing off hopelessly.

For idea 3... you want to nerf his ultimate, and that's understandable, everyone does. The reality of the situation is, you want to find a way to beat Darius up top with another traditional top-lane champion, and it's just not in the cards. Darius was created to FORCE YOU to play a different way, so start playing a different way.

Ultimately, you could slightly weaken any of these abilities to make his early game less harsh, but realistically you can't remove any of them and expect Darius to do what he was designed to do, which is dominate other melee champions. My recommendation for you is to try playing Kayle top when you play against Darius in Ranked matches, her ability to slow and kite is -extremely- effective.

if you're playing normals and don't have the option of counter-picking available, tell the jungle you are going to need consistent ganks to win your lane against Darius, as Darius is particularly weak to ganks.


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Greenlee19

Senior Member

09-09-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reathien View Post
I have a few personal ideas that could be applied to Darius, just simple things.

Idea 1. Changes to his passive:
Change his passive to physical damage, that seems like a pretty logical idea, he does physical damage with every other ability save his ult, which is true damage.
On top of this, have his passive changed to be applied on the next auto attack after using an ability (A Sheen effect), and changing his Crippling Strike to apply stacks of Hemorrhage, since it is an auto attack. It would stop darius from being able to blow all his abilities and nuke a champion, aswell as opening different build paths by making CDR a nice looking stat. The plain fact is his ult does 20% more damage per stack of hemorrhage and it does alot of damage, it should in no way be easy to apply, aswell since your ult is only usable at level 6 you should have all your abilities, making it no problem to apply the stacks.

Idea 2: Change to Apprehend.
Apprehend at the moment is a ok spell, but the passive effect on it is quite overkill. 25% armor penetration with a last whisper(40% armor Penetration) and the mastery(10%) is 75% armor penetration, leaving any amount of armor drastically reduced. 200 armor is now 50, 100 is now 25, 300 is a lowly 75, which puts him with having great damage from his abilities without needing to stack an amazing amount of attack damage. This in mind it should be reduced or removed. However that would be unfair to outright remove something without reimbursing them. In place i believe there should be a damage component to apprehend, something like 30(+30 per rank[150 base damage at rank 5]) +Base attack damage( 50ad+3.5per level leave him with +113 damage, 263 total damage at rank 5 and level 18) and +1/3 of bonus AD.
With a level 18 base of 263 damage and a third of your bonus AD it will give you a little more AOE presence while reducing the single target bursting that darius can dish out.

Idea 3: The most obvious change.
Reduce the bonus hemorrhage gives to Noxian Guillotine. Quite simple, it gets a .75 ad ratio and a high amount of base damage. Rank 1 is 160 true damage, a fair amount at level 6, but with 5 stacks of hemorrhage it suddenly turns into 320 damage +1.5 damage per bonus AD, which is ALOT of true damage at such a low level.
My idea is simple enough, cut the base AD scaling and hemorrhage boost. Change Hemorrhage to provide 10% increased damage, max +50% and reduce the base AD scaling to .5. At level 6 the base damage would be 160, with a cap of 240 +0.75 AD scaling(With 5 stacks of hemorrhage). Likewise rank 2 would be 325 max base damage, and rank 3 would be 510 base damage. Not to much of a change, just rewards building more attack damage with higher damage, but makes it not to strong if all you build is tank items.

Idea 4: Halfway ok idea.
Not the strongest idea, but changing Noxian Guillotine to have NO base damage and scale off attack damage as a whole. Thus, a straight tank Darius is going to have low low damage on his ult, while a full AD darius with 300-400 AD will have a 600-800 damage ult.

These ideas are just my own, i think they could work, its not that darius is OP, its that he just gets too much reward from building tanky than he should. Any constructive criticism would be nice.
idea 1 no the bleed stacks was ment to be the way it is small amounts of magic dmg that stacks to help his ult.

idea 2 his armor pen is an increased % off of what armor pen you have not your opponents overall armor so this is flawed

idea 3 the stacks are fine cho gath does more dmg with his ult than darius and doesnt need to stack 5 attacks to get it (note it doesnt refreash but darius's ult doesnt give him a million hp either)

idea 4 if you do this it will do no damage at all leaving darius in an even ****tier state than he already is.

Darius is a noob stomper he kills low ranking elo players and normal blind/draft pick players. anyone with any experience at all knows his weaknesses and knows hes a crappy pick. notice how all people complaining about him on the forums are either junior members or low elo ranked seniors? ANY champ in the game can kill you if you are at 25% hp just because darius has it easier does not make him op shut him out early and dont feed him just like every other champ in the game you dont want stomping your face end game and you will be fine.


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Nea De Penserhir

Senior Member

09-09-2012

I've actually never lost against a Darius who went boots.

!@#%ing wreck him hard.

That being said.

Idea 1: Nope. It's not even that damaging a passive, to be honest. It ticks every few seconds and the only way he can stack 5 stacks is if you let him.
Idea 2: Nope. 40% + 25% +10% is actually 62% armor penetration, and Darius doesn't even do that much physical damage to really worry about. He only does a lot of physical damage if he's consistently decimating at least 3 members of the enemy team, and that's a team fail, not a Darius win.
Idea 3: Nope. Building a respectable amount of AD essentially means Darius is going to get blown up. Sorry. In blind pick you merely need to adjust your tactics. In draft pick you can pick a support and top lane that render Darius useless and a complete non-factor for the entire game.
Idea 4: No other champion works on this principle, and there are about 101 champions that outclass Darius, and his ultimate, in so many ways.


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Reathien

Senior Member

09-09-2012

A) Thank you for having maturity.
B) Of all the ideas i had i felt that #2 was probably the strongest. I also said i think it could be REDUCED or removed, but at the moment it seems like quite a bit of overkill to be able to hit 75% armor pen. In reality his buff is only 25% yes, but any half wit can take the mastery and build a last whisper, the main problem is it forces people to choose health based items to counter him, which seems silly because health is more easily countered than armor. The main problem I see in matches against darius is he can build straight tanky with armor and health and shut down just about any top lane. Even a kayle could fall prey to a darius with a good jungler gank seeing as her harassment would force darius to the turret naturally from its aoe.
Something no one can argue with is his low attack damage item need for high damage. A darius with MoM laster whisper and Atmas impaler could build Warmogs and FM for +1700 hp and about 140 armor and 100 MR. That gives him 75% armor pen and a HUGE amount of AD.

Again, the problem i find with darius is his damage for damage items trade. He would be fine with less damage.


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Nea De Penserhir

Senior Member

09-09-2012

Again, it isn't 75%. It's close to 62%. If you're not going to check your numbers, you're not going to convince anyone.

I have beaten Darius with multiple champions. Maybe they were bad. Maybe I'm just Batman. But if they ~were~ bad, it means Darius DOES have player ability factor into it.

But the only difference I can see for the "good" and the "bad" Darius players is the good ones will at least survive.

Darius is trash. He is 100% complete and utter garbage. You can argue this all you want, but he is ~trash~. He cannot engage on anyone that doesn't let him. he can therefore not pressure the priority targets like he needs to. Full build Darius is still only about 32% as effective as ANY other full build Fighter.

Even Yorick, one of the worst Fighters due to his complete lack of disruption, burst, and initiation power is better than Darius. A lot better.


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Yuan Shikai

Senior Member

09-09-2012

Armor pen does not stack ADDITIVE, it stacks MULTIPLICATIVE like my preposter said, he does not get 75% armor pen, even with mastery and Last Whisper (which no Darius build except for maybe last tiem anyways) he does not get 75% armor pen, but 62%.

His passive was made magical damage for a reason, because when they tried to make it physical in his creation he was too weak and too easy coutnerable.

Also, Darius does NOT get too much rewards from building tanky, a tasnky Darius does NOT DAMAGE AT ALL except for his ult, his Q and W will do nearly no damage, he is not the least bit OP, just frustrating and Riot is already working to change THAT, but they do not plan to reduce his damage ONE BIT in the process.


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WOOHOOTROLLTIME

Recruiter

02-05-2013

really, you guys just need to learn to play a bit safe when you're around darius.

If you're a glass cannon, ask for a lane change or be extremely cautious, as I am a darius player and I love eating Teemos and Viegars for breakfast early game.

If you're ranged, just gtfo whenever he tries to get close to you. when he gets close, that means hes going to pull you and basically nuke you with everything he has.

If you're something else, good luck and don't get into pull range or u will get ****ed.

P.S. hes very vulnerable against ganks, so try to gank him early and often to keep him from killing everything early game. Also, turret hugging is another good tactic, unless he has a support that can tank some damage for him.


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