Ashe is OP

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Sidell

Junior Member

09-20-2010

Well at least each team can have only one and each side can use the character at the same time... that's kind of fair.


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Soiyeruda

Senior Member

09-20-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by QUICKSLIDE View Post
@Flowy S: If Ashe is so OP why do you have such bad scores and so many losses with her?
Don't you just love irony? :S

But yeah, Ashe is probably one of the more predictable ranged carries with fewer tricks up her sleeve.

Tristana has a deceptive burst combo that can kill most other mid champions under half hp.

Ezreal can flash closer, then spam spells on your face while auto attacking.

Kog'maw forces you to dance around and mind his distance, or risk getting severely damaged.


Ashe. . .has a predictable first strike critical, and a easy-to-dodge cone (if you hide behind minions). She can play some mind games with her ult, but under most circumstances I find it sorta predictable as well.


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dreamNing

Senior Member

09-20-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soiyeruda View Post
Don't you just love irony? :S

But yeah, Ashe is probably one of the more predictable ranged carries with fewer tricks up her sleeve.

Tristana has a deceptive burst combo that can kill most other mid champions under half hp.

Ezreal can flash closer, then spam spells on your face while auto attacking.

Kog'maw forces you to dance around and mind his distance, or risk getting severely damaged.

Ashe. . .has a predictable first strike critical, and a easy-to-dodge cone (if you hide behind minions). She can play some mind games with her ult, but under most circumstances I find it sorta predictable as well.
Your logic is fundamentally flawed. You say Ashe has few tricks and then go on to list 3 heroes who have just as few "tricks" up their sleeves.

If you're talking early game:

Tristy's burst is not deceptive, you expect if she lands her rocket jump that you will be shot a ton of times and if you're bad enough that she jumps behind you you're getting knocked somewhere unfavorable. It's tempered by her relatively weak harass early on before her range and E start picking up.

Ezrael's even more basic, he has 3 skill shots (of which only one is really useful) and you can dodge Mystic Shot way easier than you can dodge Volley by using creeps. His Flash being an initiator isn't even that scary because his overall burst potential in the laning phase is limited and his Ult is fairly easy to dodge given the large windup (it's often better used to snipe teleporters around the map).

Kog is just totally OP not because of any tricks he has, just because he has massive range and deals ~6-10% of your HP per hit.

Ashe is one of the best heroes at controlling lanes because she has better harass than most skill shotters and her burst potential isn't any less than Tristy's at level 6 (unless you let her RJ behind you and get free additional hits on you) and she has way better harass and punish before that point.

None of these heroes are particularly complex out of the gate, especially not freaking Tristana or Kog'maw.

Ezrael and Ashe have more intangibles to manage, such as waiting for passive crit (ashe), ult across map (both), sheen proc management (ez), kiting, harassment dancing, etc.

Tristy and Kog are literally "stand behind your team and autoattack theirs down."


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gun fu panda

Senior Member

09-20-2010

Ashe does not beat any other ranged carry with equal skill/farm. Ever.


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Eph289

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Senior Member

09-20-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlowyS View Post
The movespeed can be offset by going crazy move speed. for surviviability you have kiting, which you can heavily abuse to even take down 2 vs 1 in some situations. Remember, ashe can move + attack, move + volley, in almost the same animation. Which means if your focused, your enemies will at least be slowed by 35% move speed with Rank 5 Frost Arrows.

For escape, you can go with cleanse + ghost or ghost + flash. Which greatly improves ashe's suriviability.
Ashe has terrible base movespeed. It's awful. You cannot kite enough to take down a 2 v 1 as Ashe without a turret or teammates, which means it's not really a 2v1. If you go Boots 3 and stack Zeals/Phantom Dancers, you miss out on the awesome effects of Merc Treads so any CC kills you outright. If you get a Banshee's Veil AND Boots 3 AND Phantom Dancers, you hit like a wet noodle. Also, you have no damage so your kiting sucks and people can ignore you.

Did it occur to you that other people have gap-closers/can also run ghost or flash?

Go ahead, try and kite that Xin Zhao running Ghost and Exhaust or Ghost and Cleanse. Let me know how that works out. His Audacious Charge has about almost the range of Volley. His 3-talon strike takes off 20% of your health. His Crescent Sweep knocks off another 30%. He can pull off those moves in less than 2 seconds.

TL;DR: You're wrong in so many ways.


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Eph289

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Senior Member

09-20-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by gun fu panda View Post
Ashe does not beat any other ranged carry with equal skill/farm. Ever.
Long-range stun + Teleport on someone w/out Banshee's, Cleanse, or Quicksilver begs to differ, but that's a chancy gimmick at best. :P Also, she might could beat Miss Fortune if Ashe lands her ultimate from farther than point blank and flashes out of MF's Bullet Time.


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dreamNing

Senior Member

09-20-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eph2verse8and9 View Post
Long-range stun + Teleport on someone w/out Banshee's, Cleanse, or Quicksilver begs to differ, but that's a chancy gimmick at best. :P Also, she might could beat Miss Fortune if Ashe lands her ultimate from farther than point blank and flashes out of MF's Bullet Time.
The key point there is Ashe tends to outfarm a lot of carries.


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Twilexia

Senior Member

09-20-2010

Ashe does not have a good late-game. Compared to a lot of the carries other people mentioned, Ashe's late game is very weak. Her main focus is the early-mid games, where she can use her enchanted arrow and frosted arrows to slow enemies and create ganking opportunities for her team. By the time late game comes, if your team is not ahead in kills over the enemy, Ashe has basically failed.