Let's talk about abuse of the report feature

First Riot Post
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Ben Ben Ben B

Senior Member

08-22-2012

I'll post this here, instead of a new thread:


Ever since the inception and introduction of the Tribunal, it's been a bit of an enigma; rules are to be enforced on a case-by-case basis, judged by the players of the game. All of this sounds well and good - the "toxic players" (as Riot so loves to dehumanize and demean said gamers) will be dealt with by the community in a way that the community sees fit - and this, on paper, is a wonderful way to go about doing your business. Not only does this make sense from a business standpoint (Riot doesn't need to employ the massive workforce required to sift through thousands of reports), but it seems to be a perfectly democratic method of rooting out abusive, offensive, and otherwise unpleasant players from the game.

The problem, then, isn't the idea of a Tribunal. As established, a Tribunal system such as the one employed by Riot Games is quite effective in doling out punishment to players.

The problem lies in Riot Games' (well, more specifically, the infamous "PB&J" team who regulates player behaviour's) complete disregard for a fundamental concept regarding law enforcement: the rule of law. Most academic students will already be familiar with the term: the Rule of Law, as Wikipedia states, is a legal principle "whereby governmental decisions are made by applying known legal principles."

The byte upon which I'd like to focus in that statement is known legal principles. By definition, a ruler who functions under the Rule of Law must govern in a way which synthesizes with their "rulebook" (that is, their codified system of laws which applies to the governed of their state).

The rule of law is fundamental to democratic practice, to just punishment and to proper governance as a whole. We've all learned this in law class - the importance of codified laws (which are enforced fairly) is one of the ultimate goals of a democratic state.

So, then, what does this have to do with the Tribunal system (and the "PB&J"? If you haven't connected the dots yet, here's the point of this thread (and I suppose my "thesis", so to say): the recent "mass-banning" by Lyte & Krew is a perfect example of Riot's complete ignorance of the rule of law. If anyone is to take the "PB&J" even remotely seriously as an institution for player justice, a codified system of laws needs to exist (i.e., people need to know what is and what isn't against the rules.

By these standards (the standards by which legitimate governments abide), then, not only were the recent bannings unjust, but they were a gross representation of Riot's unwillingness to acknowledge a fundamental facet of fair and balanced governance: the rule of law.

-- To a lesser extent, this applies to Tribunal banning as well; players who are "dealt with" through the Tribunal are punished or pardoned seemingly arbitrarily -- that is, a player can punish someone based on their preconceptions of what rules should be (for example, "gg noobs" or whatever), rather than rules that are explicitly stated by Riot Games. Although this applies to a much lesser extent (because it takes a hefty amount of agreeing "punishes" to prosecute a player through the Tribunal), it still demonstrates the same dichotomy in Riot's logic.

I pretty much just typed this in the last 10 minutes or so after coming back from a break (and noticing all the bans or whatever), so if I got something wrong in terms of facts or whatever, please let me know. If you'd like me to elaborate on my statements let me know, too.

And please don't just downvote or upvote then leave - post your opinion on the matter and let's get some Red posts in here too.

Thanks for reading, yo.


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The Cpt America

Senior Member

08-22-2012

I am really curious about my account TBH

I get into a lot of fights it seems, especially in normal games when i do play - A lot of people are usually like "oh high ELO or platinum, did not carry reported," or "GG the cpt a-hole trash talker" when i say one thing...

sometimes i report people when this gets excessive and such but in general i just report people who say they are going to report me when i think there was no reason to report me

Edit: Also i usually am too lazy to add in comments on reports, i just select what they were doing like intentionally feeding or what not... i just report and move on?


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GrowlyGuts

Senior Member

08-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by fremz View Post
The magic word there is "toxic"
They think banning people who are undeserving with no warning is justice.
After a week of ban watch people who will no longer use the report feature.
Enjoy the game full of trolls.
I guess they never thought of that.
You don't get it. People who report in a reasonable manner won't change their habits.

People who got banned either will stop using the report feature, at least as much or they will be banned again.

This is the desired outcome, not some unintended consequence.


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Hearts Grow

Senior Member

08-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyte View Post
I can't keep up with multiple threads, so I'm going to consolidate the information here. I am happy to answer questions in this thread; however, I cannot look up everyone's account and provide comments about their account's behavior history. If you have a legitimate, reasonable request, I'll look into a few accounts here and there.

---

Our Player Support teams actually sweep accounts for toxic behaviors on a frequent basis and we've empowered them to hand out direct bans as necessary without prior warnings if they catch players displaying excessive racism, bigotry, or other toxic behaviors in their matches. We use these sweeps to determine whether we are doing enough for our community and to check the accuracy and speed of systems such as the Tribunal and LeaverBuster. The Tribunal is just one piece of the solution to player behavior, but we realized we need to do more.

We've been receiving a lot of complaints from our community about how the act of reporting has created a more toxic environment for other players; players will write in about having a poor game and someone screaming profanities at them and threatening them with reports and bans.

Because of these complaints, we decided to run analyses and metrics against some of the players who reported the highest number of players in the game (after normalizing for games played and all that fun math stuff). We found something a bit surprising and a bit shocking. There were some players that had reported over 1000 times more players than the average player in the population! In addition, these players were often extremely toxic in their games and had repeated cases that were punished in the Tribunal. When we analyzed chat logs in this population, we noticed that they were using reports in an offensive and abusive manner. For example, these players would often say "Enjoy your report f@ggot!" or "everyone in this game, plz report this n*gger." Not all players behaved in this way, but these players were consistently negative towards their teammates in their matches and often tried to convince others to report someone in the game. Many of these players reported for issues (such as playing a poor game) that were not legitimate according to Riot staff standards.

The decision we made today was not easy. It was actually quite sad and a bit depressing for me. We knew that we had never banned for something like this in the past; however, as we dug into the data more, we realized how toxic these players were to their teammates and their opponents and we knew that a verbal warning would not be enough.

These are players that were abusing our report feature and using it as a tool to bully, criticize and frustrate other players in the game. These players that try to get decent players banned from the game! Many of these players already had Tribunal histories and already had their report weights set to 0, but we felt that these acts were distinct enough that an additional punishment was warranted because the Tribunal was not designed to combat abusive reporting.

Today, we decided to give a 7-day timeout to players who were the worst 0.2% of players who abused the report feature and had displayed toxic behavior in their recent matches.

The bans were harsh, I agree. But, we felt they were warranted given the level of abuse these players were involved with. I will continue to answer questions in this thread, let's keep it constructive.
As a player who was banned, I will admit, A VERBAL WARNING WOULD HAVE BEEN ENOUGH!!!!

I still don't know why I was banned.

How did I make it through BETA-CURRENT and I'm now THE TOXIC AVENGER???

Surely I have SOOOO many reports since BETA! I do not believe for one second that anyone has gone through my match history to give me a good determination that I am a TOXIC PLAYER and deserve a SEVEN DAY FIRST BAN!!!

THIS IS WRONG!


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nickelbagschwagg

Member

08-22-2012

Lyte dodging my responses since 2012


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Astronautical

Senior Member

08-22-2012

Whole lotta butthurt in this thread.
you got banned and you deserved it.


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grybranix

Senior Member

08-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Ben Ben B View Post
I'll post this here, instead of a new thread:


Ever since the inception and introduction of the Tribunal, it's been a bit of an enigma; rules are to be enforced on a case-by-case basis, judged by the players of the game. All of this sounds well and good - the "toxic players" (as Riot so loves to dehumanize and demean said gamers) will be dealt with by the community in a way that the community sees fit - and this, on paper, is a wonderful way to go about doing your business. Not only does this make sense from a business standpoint (Riot doesn't need to employ the massive workforce required to sift through thousands of reports), but it seems to be a perfectly democratic method of rooting out abusive, offensive, and otherwise unpleasant players from the game.

The problem, then, isn't the idea of a Tribunal. As established, a Tribunal system such as the one employed by Riot Games is quite effective in doling out punishment to players.

The problem lies in Riot Games' (well, more specifically, the infamous "PB&J" team who regulates player behaviour's) complete disregard for a fundamental concept regarding law enforcement: the rule of law. Most academic students will already be familiar with the term: the Rule of Law, as Wikipedia states, is a legal principle "whereby governmental decisions are made by applying known legal principles."

The byte upon which I'd like to focus in that statement is known legal principles. By definition, a ruler who functions under the Rule of Law must govern in a way which synthesizes with their "rulebook" (that is, their codified system of laws which applies to the governed of their state).

The rule of law is fundamental to democratic practice, to just punishment and to proper governance as a whole. We've all learned this in law class - the importance of codified laws (which are enforced fairly) is one of the ultimate goals of a democratic state.

So, then, what does this have to do with the Tribunal system (and the "PB&J"? If you haven't connected the dots yet, here's the point of this thread (and I suppose my "thesis", so to say): the recent "mass-banning" by Lyte % Krew is a perfect example of Riot's complete ignorance of the rule of law. If anyone is to take the "PB&J" even remotely seriously as an institution for player justice, a codified system of laws needs to exist (i.e., people need to know what is and what isn't against the rules.

By these standards (the standards by which legitimate governments abide), then, not only were the recent bannings unjust, but they were a gross representation of Riot's unwillingness to acknowledge a fundamental facet of fair and balanced governance: the rule of law.

-- To a lesser extent, this applies to Tribunal banning as well; players who are "dealt with" through the Tribunal are punished or pardoned seemingly arbitrarily -- that is, a player can punish someone based on their preconceptions of what rules should be (for example, "gg noobs" or whatever), rather than rules that are explicitly stated by Riot Games. Although this applies to a much lesser extent (because it takes a hefty amount of agreeing "punishes" to prosecute a player through the Tribunal), it still demonstrates the same dichotomy in Riot's logic.

I pretty much just typed this in the last 10 minutes or so after coming back from a break (and noticing all the bans or whatever), so if I got something wrong in terms of facts or whatever, please let me know. If you'd like me to elaborate on my statements let me know, too.

And please don't just downvote or upvote then leave - post your opinion on the matter and let's get some Red posts in here too.

Thanks for reading, yo.
+1


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PUR3ICE

Senior Member

08-22-2012

Since i play.
Since this 3years this is one of the biggest things that annoyed me so much,
1st blood. REPORT HIM OMG !!!!
REPORT MY TEAM
REPORT HIM FOR USING BOOTS OF SWIFTNESS.,NO ORACLE I HOPE YOU GET BANNED.
Thanks for introducing this.
Allways wanted this.

But however you maybee have to look the amount of reports with the time the player played.
I saw for example a blue tagged guy (Adjudicator) who also was banned.
For those who donīt know - Adjudicator are the very 1st players from the beginning of the LeagueofLegends.
He did a thread where he is telling that he never did "false" reports, but reports against toxic players.

However maybee you did the mistake to not compare the amounts of reports to the amount of games he played.

But anyways GJ!


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ViperVentedos

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

08-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by grybranix View Post
You guys need to get a data analyst on your team because you have no idea what the **** you're doing

seriously you are so blindingly incompetent it completely blows my mind
because you, probably a high school student, can do worlds better than ppl whose Job it is to look after millions of other players online activities while playing the game and determine if the person is a toxic influence. yea im sure you can do the job they do better


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RazorWarrior

Senior Member

08-22-2012

Lyte I haven't had any warnings or bans on my account but I believe my report button has been disabled (justified). I know I have abused it when I was frustrated more than once and I know it was wrong and I'm sorry. Is there anything I can do to get it re-enabled again?