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Riot. AP Kat Or No Kat Is Not Acceptable.

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Ziggy Irelia

Senior Member

08-09-2012

Quote:
Katarìna:
You totally didn't understand the correlation between skill at CSing and why that makes rushing Gunblade viable did you?


You totally don't understand gunblade is not built for CSing. If it were built for CSing, then people would start bilgewater instead of revolver. It's built for the active and spellvamp mostly.


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Vesh

Game Designer

08-09-2012

Quote:
Tahke:
it doesn't matter, u have to be in their face to use ur w and u just get blown up and if u buy items to keep u alive then u do no damage. BB was great for harass now it's mediocre in comparison. I've played like 10 games already with new kat on PBE and she's definitely 100% weaker


W has a much larger AOE radius than you think and also gives you movement speed to disengage from the trade. You'd be surprised how much lane control it gives you without having to get in melee range.


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Ahriman1

Senior Member

08-09-2012

Quote:
Duckie006:
You totally don't understand gunblade is not built for CSing. If it were built for CSing, then people would start bilgewater instead of revolver. It's built for the active and spellvamp mostly.


You misinterpreted the idea behind that post. What he was saying is that being able to farm better makes gunblade more viable because you get it earlier.

Scarra is going to be able to get a gunblade easily 5 to 10 minutes before I would. This changes the effect it has on the game. I still think gunblade is a good choice for me, but it IS a different idea entirely.


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Josh de Tonreau

Senior Member

08-09-2012

Quote:
Vesh:
W has a much larger AOE radius than you think and also gives you movement speed to disengage from the trade. You'd be surprised how much lane control it gives you without having to get in melee range.


I'm very off topic sorry but please tell them to loo into changing her run animations
Like I'm begging u please mention it because it's just not her
Please


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Ziggy Irelia

Senior Member

08-09-2012

Quote:
Ahriman1:
You misinterpreted the idea behind that post. What he was saying is that being able to farm better makes gunblade more viable because you get it earlier.

Scarra is going to be able to get a gunblade easily 5 to 10 minutes before I would. This changes the effect it has on the game. I still think gunblade is a good choice for me, but it IS a different idea entirely.


Scarra usually gets his gunblade 16:30 - 18:30. I get it at about the same time unless I'm feeding. Scarra is also 1400 elo ahead of me. Whether I misinterpret his point or not, he's still wrong and very dumb.


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Chase Dotters

Senior Member

08-09-2012

Quote:
Vesh:
W has a much larger AOE radius than you think and also gives you movement speed to disengage from the trade. You'd be surprised how much lane control it gives you without having to get in melee range.


thank you for improving her laning phase, but does her lvl 1 improve? Cause if she'll be weak as a lvl 1, she may not be as good as people would think in competitive play. How is her late game?


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Josh de Tonreau

Senior Member

08-09-2012

I'm tired


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ArtemusD

Senior Member

08-09-2012

Quote:
Vesh:
W has a much larger AOE radius than you think and also gives you movement speed to disengage from the trade. You'd be surprised how much lane control it gives you without having to get in melee range.


I think I can speak on behalf of many frustrated Katarina players when I say the following:

She didn't really need a rework. Her model, sure, but everything else? Why?

In my days of playing her, I saw nothing wrong with the champion. Killer Instincts was versatile, and its otherwise long CD had to make me think weather I wanted to engage or not. It's not my job to poke down the enemy mid, it's my job to run in there, kill people, run out. That's the whole point of an assassin, yeah?

I feel that the new W is just...not worth replacing what she had. I'm aware that I'm not going to talk you guys out of it just because I'm unhappy with the shift in play, but it sort of removes the niche that she used to have.

That aside, word is that her scaling on Shunpo was pretty much drained into this ability. Now it looks like it's used simply for the sake of blinking, not for actual damage (see Arcane Shift). If that wasn't enough, Bouncing Blade reduced to just 4 bounces? Granted, this is all secondhand info, but if this is true...why bother even playing Kat? Since the daggers don't have prioritization to champions, there's a much stronger percentage that during her early game, there is no way to hit the enemy champion. Yes, the mark is neat and all, but with Shunpo's reduced damage, why would I get close enough to do that? It seems like to ideally trade with someone in mid, I'd have to walk up to them, hit a dagger, shunpo, use this new W, and then walk out.

The way that calls out in my head, doesn't exactly seem like an even trade, especially if I'm laning against someone like Veigar or Ashe. The W seems to help with farming, which is nice and all, but that seems to be all it can be used for. Mark some minions, farm.

What agitates me most? Reductions on her ultimate. I can forgive the 1 second channel time (because most players are either dead or flash anyway), but the 200 base damage reduction? Come on.

Please shed clarity on this, or tell me that the information I got this from is just mad that they did badly. Or something. I really liked Katarina the way she was, and didn't think she needed a change.

Viktor on the other hand.....still has an invisible laser.


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Katarìna

Senior Member

08-09-2012

Quote:
Vesh:
This just isn't the case. Her W still scales off AD and is a TON of your damage. Having two abilities scale off AD would be detrimental to her itemization. It's very tricky when you do magic damage with AD items because it limits your options to a few select pure AD items with no attack speed or crit. Gunblade is still awesome on her.


Edit: Her ult also scales off AD still, making a further case for gunblade. In addition, you now have another spammable spell to spellvamp off of while BB is on cooldown. You also don't have to burn shunpo to help last hit anymore, meaning it can always be up in case you get ganked.


Vesh, I appreciate the time you took to post, but I think you don't fully understand why some of us are against removal of the AD ratio on Bouncing Blade. If you guys are so deadset against multiple spells with dual ratios, make the new W only scale with AP, and let us keep our AD scaling on BB.

Removing the AD ratio, and the W>Q full damage/healing reduction functionality is a nerf to Kat's laning no matter how you spin it, especially when my very good poke with a healing reduction is being traded for a spell that probably isn't any larger than Lotus' 550 range, and smaller than most common matchup's spells and autos. Remember, Kat is a melee champ. She fights ranged champs more often than not.


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Josh de Tonreau

Senior Member

08-09-2012

Kinda scared now