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Can Diana lane well enough in ranked to be viable?

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GatorHatur

Senior Member

08-12-2012

Yes, I think that with any champion there are a variety of builds, some highlight different aspects of play better than others, but thats the nature of a game with so many item combinations. The possibilities are endless.


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Lethadind

Senior Member

08-12-2012

Returning to the OP's question, I believe Diana makes a much better top laner than mid laner, and I also agree with others that her strengths lie mostly in jungling. Top lane champs are usually AD Bruisers. Diana is sort of an anti-bruiser. She keeps these guys in (most of whom do not have escapes) at melee range (they have to engage her at melee range anyway), and because she is a great jungler, she is also an asset to her jungler for ganks, a QRW, AA, E, QR, R will usually finish off anyone in conjunction with what the jungler brings in as well.

Mid lane Diana has only one gap closer and no escapes, and she is melee, and has to wait for that gap closer until level 6. She can poke with Q (it's really efficient, actually, at hitting the champion and dodging the minions the way it arcs) until 6, but that's about it, and if she does that it's very mana intensive after awhile. Meanwhile most mages are ranged and all they have to do is AA poke her back. Unlike Fizz, who is also melee and counters a slew of normal mid lane champs, she has no means of escape once she's engaged, therefore it's a commitment to engage, you have to know you'll get the kill. For Fizz it's all part of his poke and harass.

Post-6 as long as you are on at least even grounds with your opponent, Diana gets a lot scarier in any lane.


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Etherimp

Senior Member

08-12-2012

Quote:
Lethadind:
Returning to the OP's question, I believe Diana makes a much better top laner than mid laner, and I also agree with others that her strengths lie mostly in jungling. Top lane champs are usually AD Bruisers. Diana is sort of an anti-bruiser. She keeps these guys in (most of whom do not have escapes) at melee range (they have to engage her at melee range anyway), and because she is a great jungler, she is also an asset to her jungler for ganks, a QRW, AA, E, QR, R will usually finish off anyone in conjunction with what the jungler brings in as well.

Mid lane Diana has only one gap closer and no escapes, and she is melee, and has to wait for that gap closer until level 6. She can poke with Q (it's really efficient, actually, at hitting the champion and dodging the minions the way it arcs) until 6, but that's about it, and if she does that it's very mana intensive after awhile. Meanwhile most mages are ranged and all they have to do is AA poke her back. Unlike Fizz, who is also melee and counters a slew of normal mid lane champs, she has no means of escape once she's engaged, therefore it's a commitment to engage, you have to know you'll get the kill. For Fizz it's all part of his poke and harass.

Post-6 as long as you are on at least even grounds with your opponent, Diana gets a lot scarier in any lane.


I don't agree that she's an anti-bruiser. She's an anti-carry/assassin. She does better mid lane than top.


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GatorHatur

Senior Member

08-12-2012

I agree with that sentiment...Etherimp. She should be played primarily mid or jungle.. Most of the time you will play against squishy mids, but at top your very relient on lvl 6 (as with any lane) but more so at top


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Ahxakri

Senior Member

08-12-2012

Diana is honestly another Bruiser in my opinion. She shares the exact same role as Udyr, Shyvana, and other Bruisers. Their job is to stick to the AD Carry/AP Carry like glue and make sure they die. They all have extremely good gap closers to assure this. The thing is, is she is probably the best AP Bruiser. Bruisers aren't suppose to have MASSIVE damage, but they're not suppose to be MASSIVELY tanky. They're suppose to have enough survivability to jump in, get their job done, and maybe keep up with the teamfight.

So, let's stick with the term Bruiser. She isn't anti-anything TBH, she merely shares the same role as other champions and does it extremely well.


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Lethadind

Senior Member

08-12-2012

Quote:
Etherimp:
I don't agree that she's an anti-bruiser. She's an anti-carry/assassin. She does better mid lane than top.


Your reasoning? I'm not saying I'm unwilling to budge, but the evidence I provided shows she does the anti-bruising pretty well - as she does AP damage bruisers have to switch up their build to counter her, and she sticks to them like a smelly old booger. She has her dual shield proc that protects her immensely during trades as well, she can go in, poke them, proc an auto attack and peace out before her shield is broken twice, taking no damage (this is early 1-4 obv, afterwards they usually have enough damage to break the shield).

Give me some reasons why you think she's more viable mid, I'm curious. My experience is that many mids counter her pretty hard, but admittedly I'm not the most experienced LoL player.


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GatorHatur

Senior Member

08-12-2012

[QUOTE=Lethadind;28161833]Your reasoning? I'm not saying I'm unwilling to budge, but the evidence I provided shows she does the anti-bruising pretty well - as she does AP damage bruisers have to switch up their build to counter her, and she sticks to them like a smelly old booger. She has her dual shield proc that protects her immensely during trades as well, she can go in, poke them, proc an auto attack and peace out before her shield is broken twice, taking no damage (this is early 1-4 obv, afterwards they usually have enough damage to break the shield).

Give me some reasons why you think she's more viable mid, I'm curious. My experience is that many mids counter her pretty hard, but admittedly I'm not the most experienced LoL player.[/QUOTE

For the same reason shes an anti bruiser... If shes is capable of shutting down bruisers why wouldn't she be able to do the same at mid? He crescent strike poke is nuts with a full AP page... you'll hit another mid for 1/4-1/3 of their health every time... There is a reason its a skill shot... Because it takes skill to hit... which also implies that you can skillfully place it to hit someone trying to dodge it... I don't, however, disagree that she can play any lane she wants... But how hard she can hit can really be utilized the most at mid


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Lethadind

Senior Member

08-12-2012

Quote:
GatorHatur:
For the same reason shes an anti bruiser... If shes is capable of shutting down bruisers why wouldn't she be able to do the same at mid? He crescent strike poke is nuts with a full AP page... you'll hit another mid for 1/4-1/3 of their health every time... There is a reason its a skill shot... Because it takes skill to hit... which also implies that you can skillfully place it to hit someone trying to dodge it... I don't, however, disagree that she can play any lane she wants... But how hard she can hit can really be utilized the most at mid


You missed your brackets on the quote by the way

My reasoning for her being so good top is she has a lot more room to stick to them with, and THEY usually have to get into melee range to harass HER as well. Exceptions - Gangplank, Pantheon, Teemo, etc. In these cases you can mana trade as her Q is relatively low compared to most poke abilities.

Most mids are ranged, so they can poke her without using mana. I know how to land her Q, but it's still very obvious what you're doing if they have half a brain and you don't want to push the lane (moving outside slightly so the arc misses the minions), half of your Q's won't hit regardless of how good you are, unless you want to push the lane by surprising them, but allowing the arc to hit minions. To make use of her stickiness (on a much smaller lane) you have to get up close to them with no means of escape if something nasty happens.


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Algeria

Junior Member

08-12-2012

I would right away build sorcerer shoes, followed by sheen, into leach bane, then rabadons, and rylia's, then voidstaff/abbysal scepter also zhonyas is a must on diana at sum point. max ur q then w and e last r whenever u can, ALWAYS remember to cast q before anything else, once u land it the rest is easy if u can follow ur dmg untill u get kill. summoner spells i get clarity and ignite, or ignite and flash, and if jungling smite/ignite or smite/flash


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Etherimp

Senior Member

08-12-2012

Quote:
Lethadind:
Your reasoning? I'm not saying I'm unwilling to budge, but the evidence I provided shows she does the anti-bruising pretty well - as she does AP damage bruisers have to switch up their build to counter her, and she sticks to them like a smelly old booger. She has her dual shield proc that protects her immensely during trades as well, she can go in, poke them, proc an auto attack and peace out before her shield is broken twice, taking no damage (this is early 1-4 obv, afterwards they usually have enough damage to break the shield).

Give me some reasons why you think she's more viable mid, I'm curious. My experience is that many mids counter her pretty hard, but admittedly I'm not the most experienced LoL player.


Because any bruiser that can stand and trade with her will win.

1. She's cooldown dependent. Most bruisers are Auto-attack dependent. AA is faster than CD.

2. She has no inherent sustain. IE - no lifesteal/spell vamp without items. Someone who is tanky enough to handle her burst will start regaining life off of their AA's making her job harder every second they're in combat with her.

3. She has no real escapes. Bruisers usually have some kind of CC/escape. Silence, stun, slow, etc. Granted, she can stick to them, but the point remains that she can't escape if she wants to, but they can disengage.

4. She's mana hungry and mana dependent. AD Bruisers are not so much.

5. Aside from her short duration shield, she's pretty squishy. For her to make her tanky you have to sacrifice her damage, which will make her much less useful against carries late game, where her ability to quickly nuke them will be needed.

6. Most bruisers run Merc Treads and Mr/Lvl Blues, as well as 9/21/0 masteries. This provides more than enough defense to trade with Diana.

You can compare her a lot to Akali.. The same champs who would counter Akali would counter Diana pretty hard for the same reasons. Garen is a good example. AA, Silence, AA, Spin, Ignite, Ulti = Dead Diana, and Diana would hardly scratch Garen.

The reason I think you're mistaking her for a bruiser is because most bruisers are also anti-carries. Difference is, Anti carries like Garen, Darius, Trundle, are anti-carries because they can take enough damage to survive breaking through the enemy line and they can deal enough damage to be threatening to a carry OVER TIME... ASSASSINS, like Xin, Akali, TF, Diana, and Katarina succeed in being an anti-carry by isolating the carry and laying them to waste with heavy burst damage, then getting the F out of dodge before the enemy team focuses them.


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