Upcoming Zyra Changes

First Riot Post
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Who is Sexy

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Senior Member

08-07-2012

imba 4 nerf because high elo do well with her in tournaments


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Apollinarius

Senior Member

08-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mixxkilla View Post
Really I dont understand why people are crying about this. Zyra is OP if not she very STRONG. I can't even play her well and if I manage to hit my snare, I face roll the keyboard till the enemy dies, I mean like really? like i just put my cursor on top of the champ and profit.

P.S.Can you fix/improve Zyra's Passive? I smart cast spells, and when I die and happen to click a skill key, the passive locks on to were my cursor was before its even ready to shoot, then when the plant head pops out it shoots in the direction that my cursor was.
A lot of champions are like that. Morgana, Lux, Varus, Ryze all immobilize and then kill.

I have seen Zyra win one out of the six games I've seen her played in. Doesn't feel that op.


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Xaxas

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Senior Member

08-07-2012

Man oh man, you jsut broke her, like, it feels inhuman to do such a thing to a virtual "champion"/pixels, that's how hard you nerfed her. She's the new post-nerf pre-buff Eve....

2 times, 2 times I landed my combo with 2 DIFFERENT seeds ok a TRISTANA (squishy adc) with my lane partner (yes I was bot) attacking her two, SHE ESCAPED with what could probably be less than 1% health.

Certainlyt, I hope you learned well how to nerf a character to the ground from Morello; landing her combo doesn't feel good and rewarding anymore, UNABLE to get kills after pretty much landing everything on the whole team in teamfights... Bullied out of lane pretty hard, congratulations on making the most aggressive support Riot and making me waste 6300 ip you're welcome to check my match history...


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Gafugarion

Senior Member

08-07-2012

Cool I know how to play Zyra prenerf now.


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Eleshakai

Senior Member

08-07-2012

I don't really see the need for these specific nerfs, but okay.... if that's what you wanna nerf lol


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PraiseTheWallSnK

Senior Member

08-07-2012

The only one I don't like are the MS nurfs, other than that everything looks nice.


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Vegas Dad

Senior Member

08-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Certainlyt View Post
LeBlanc is a massive lane bully with very low team fight presence. Zyra arguably offers the most late game utility of any mage we've ever released. LeBlanc needs to dominate lane to have any relevance at all; Zyra doesn't.
These are the type of statements that really show your lack of balance concepts. You are fine to allow LB to be an insane lane bully, almost immune to ganks.... and sorry her team fight presence is the ability to instantly pop the cary of your choice even if it is a trade it is a trade you dictate.

but then you condem other champs for having strengths....it is very inconsistent and poor balance. It is like darius you made him this unstoppable force to lane against yet that IS THE GAME laning is incredibly important.....

then you release diana.... who has insane lane presence and safety, and the "PERFECT" jungle kit as well.

You need to start to really take a look at your design, creating champs that are entitled to win thier lane is not good for the game. creating champs with the perfect kit is not good for the game.


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IS1deeec2921fc4a7106d93

Junior Member

08-07-2012

New Riot business plan : Give a new champion totally imbah so that everybody buy it, next nerf him when new chamion comes.


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ObscureClockwork

Senior Member

08-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegas Dad View Post
These are the type of statements that really show your lack of balance concepts. You are fine to allow LB to be an insane lane bully, almost immune to ganks.... and sorry her team fight presence is the ability to instantly pop the cary of your choice even if it is a trade it is a trade you dictate.

but then you condem other champs for having strengths....it is very inconsistent and poor balance. It is like darius you made him this unstoppable force to lane against yet that IS THE GAME laning is incredibly important.....

then you release diana.... who has insane lane presence and safety, and the "PERFECT" jungle kit as well.

You need to start to really take a look at your design, creating champs that are entitled to win thier lane is not good for the game. creating champs with the perfect kit is not good for the game.
the problem lies in AoE and Single target nature.
the reason leblanc is allowed to be a lane bully is because she is single target.

the reason zyra is not allowed to be a lane bully is because
she is utility mage are lux, orianna, and anivia (and possibly gragas) lane bullies? they normally dont have the sustain to be a lane bully.

she is mainly AoE. orianna is less of a lane bully than lux, because orianna is more aoe. lux is less of a lane bully than anivia, because lux is more aoe, and so on, and so on. (gragas is an exception because he is melee, and thus has other criteria balancing him)

She has less risk built in. leblanc needs to be closer to the target she wants to assassinate than zyra. leblanc also runs more risk of not bursting someone down than zyra, because she lacks consistent dps (unlike zyra, who has plants to do dps, or orianna, hwo has her autos, or anivia, who has her R) lux has a similar nature, and hence can be a bigger lane bully than orianna, because she is more burst based, and lacks defined dps. (this is similar with anivia, who normally can lack sustain to keep her dps up)

she has lockdowns. lockdowns can possibly bring far more than leblanc can ever bring. while leblanc can bring someone with, one lockdown for sufficient time can stop advancing teams, kill one person, disable someone for a set amount of time, and others. utility is quite a deciding factor in lane bullying. orianna doesn't get her 900 range zone because she already backs utility for after the lane phase. leblanc gets her strong lane because she does not have as much going for her late game.


also, leblanc and darius and diana aren't entitled to winning their lanes. (and zyra has probably a bigger lane presence than them pre-nerf) if you counter-build effectively and deny them early lane advantages such as kills (i think leblanc is balanced around getting kills) they become less significant late game.
pretty much its a carry vs mage senario. you technicaly play the role of the carry, leblanc plays the role of the mage.
the carry is meant to have weaker early game, and stronger late game. the mage has weaker late, but stronger early.

the problem for riot lies in people who have a strong early and a strong late, such as kennen, and vlad, and potentially orianna, and other people. there is a reason people like them are extremely hard to balance, and that kennen and vlad are considered mistakes in design (why do you think there are no more ranged manaless champions? unless they come up with a good balance for them, they are just too difficult to keep well balanced at times)


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ObscureClockwork

Senior Member

08-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apollinarius View Post
A lot of champions are like that. Morgana, Lux, Varus, Ryze all immobilize and then kill.

I have seen Zyra win one out of the six games I've seen her played in. Doesn't feel that op.
zyra doesnt carry the same risks as morgana

morgana ult starts at 600 range. she has no speed up skills.
from 600-825, that is a 0.6 second window to retaliate.
morgana's problem is probably balance-wise, with how strong her utility is, but generally, she has risk built in, unlike pre-nerf zyra.

lux has risk built in too. to get full damage, you need her auto (and lich potentially)
she is also all burst with pretty much no dps. thats more risk than burst+dps
550 range to get into, with no self haste is pretty risky regardless.

Varus is an utility AD carry. he is supposed to do damage first regardless, he is supposed to dominate you late game regardless (provided he did cs well enough) he is also supposed to have some form of utility other ad carries dont have (so you know, he can be different, and a utility ad carry?)
he lacks a strong dps steroid compared to people like kog maw, vayne, and corki, and thus he gets utility and a less "ad-carry-like" bursty steroid

ryze also has a lot of risk built in due to range. his problem is just mana items probably were never built to scale as damage items, and thus, ryze becomes too tanky and does too high of damage. he has risk built in, just that his build does cut many of those weaknesses. i do want to believe riot has him on their radar, but im not so sure.
the problem is just he does way high damage with way high tankiness compared to other mages. riot probably knows that, but probably cant resolve the issue with a quick fix