How to counter all AD Carrys so hard that they are useless

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Cenerae

Senior Member

08-04-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Etherimp View Post
Lifesteal alone does not counter Thornmail, sorry.

A nice balanced combination of Lifesteal (Blood Thirster will do), Armor Pen (Last Whisper), and Magic Resist (Banshees Veil.)


That said.. The OP is correct. Getting a Thornmail before AD Carries have any Armor Pen or Magic Resist will pretty much force them to stop focusing you (or die.) ASSUMING...


And here's the catch to thornmail: You have a decent sized Health pool.


Thornmail w/ only 1500-2000 HP? = Not that difficult to deal with.

Thornmail + Lots of HP = Bad day to be an AD carry

Thornmail on a Rammus who's in DBC with a Warmogs = /surrender
Two things.

1) If you are a tank or a bruiser, you don't WANT the enemy AD to prioritise hitting other people. Because your team mates are squishier. If you're a carry, thornmail is a waste of a slot (GA is better)

2) Rammus does not need a Thornmail. He has more important things to get first, and it's not his job to 'kill the carry' with reflective damage (which he won't be able to do anyway, because the AD will stop hitting him the second the taunt wears off)


People need to stop looking at Thornmail as something that 'counters AD'. It does not counter AD. It is merely a cheap source of armor (100 armor for 2k gold is MUCH cheaper than buying a frozen heart or randuins). The damage reflection counters enemy lifesteal to a point. That is all it does. Can it help you beat an AD carry? Sure. But it is not a counter-pick item.


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BillyTheBanana

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Junior Member

08-04-2012

Since no one has mentioned it: Quicksilver Sash.


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DemonicUtensil

Member

08-04-2012

today I learned: Buying armor items is effective against characters that deal physical damage.


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Judas Priest

Senior Member

08-04-2012

CC + burst, works against all ADC. Depending on the champion (and on how fed he is), the burst needs to come from more then 1 ally.


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Etherimp

Senior Member

08-04-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cenerae View Post
Two things.

1) If you are a tank or a bruiser, you don't WANT the enemy AD to prioritise hitting other people. Because your team mates are squishier. If you're a carry, thornmail is a waste of a slot (GA is better)

2) Rammus does not need a Thornmail. He has more important things to get first, and it's not his job to 'kill the carry' with reflective damage (which he won't be able to do anyway, because the AD will stop hitting him the second the taunt wears off)


People need to stop looking at Thornmail as something that 'counters AD'. It does not counter AD. It is merely a cheap source of armor (100 armor for 2k gold is MUCH cheaper than buying a frozen heart or randuins). The damage reflection counters enemy lifesteal to a point. That is all it does. Can it help you beat an AD carry? Sure. But it is not a counter-pick item.

I don't disagree with you, necessarily.

As a bruiser, I (almost) never buy Thornmail.

As Rammus, I like Thornmail. It synergizes extremely well with his kit. But, as you said, it's not the first item I go for. Health > Armor > MR > Optional items.

As far as "they will stop shooting you as soon as taunt is done", that may be true.. BUT..

The AD carries job is to target OPPORTUNITY targets.. Meaning, they will shoot whoever is closest, or they will NOT shoot.. Rammus's job is to be in the middle of the fray and lay down CC/AOE, peel for his carries, and help to pick off priority targets.. With Frozen Heart or Randuins (or both), the AD carry will be able to slowly pick away at Rammus. Thornmail makes this a very dangerous thing for them to do, and so they either don't do it or they get punished for it when they do.

It's indirect damage/non focused damage/pressure, and yes, it's a ton of Armor.

You also have to consider the fact that while at your Elo (hidden or ranked), players may be smart enough to not shoot the Thornmail target... they aren't at ALL Elo's. Thornmail is extremely effective at levels where people do not pay close attention to enemy builds.


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Velpro

Senior Member

08-04-2012

I'd rather just have Urgot and Trundle hold hands as they run into a crowd of AD carries.


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acosn

Senior Member

08-04-2012

Thornmail is primarily for AD and AP soaks that want to focused to some degree, but not endlessly.

Most dedicated tanks will find a better value in a Frozen Heart.

The other little conditional for buying a thornmail is that for what it does, and compared to it's price, you really only buy it when dealing with 2+ auto-attacking AD characters.

Unless you're Rammus.


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silversurfer092

Member

08-04-2012

I heard that if you don't feed other AD carries, they are pretty useless. Could be a rumor.


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Ouroborous HD

Senior Member

08-04-2012

urgot is always the answer when dealing with an ADC


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Nevercrysis

Senior Member

08-04-2012

Iīve been playing as AD Carry since long time, and the last enemy we want to focus is the tank. Itīs noob for an AD Carry to hit it when there are other squishies to kill. You got lots armor? We can counter it with any armor penetration item.

What makes an AD carry useless is not any item, but the way you play the game:

1. Outfarm. Any AD Carry need lots farm to make money. It is the main money resource. Do not let them farm, and with some good ganks, he wonīt be able to do great damages later.
2. Usually AD Carry hates champs like Jax, Xin Zhao, Jarvan, etc.. Meelee champs who can dash or jump, that can do great damages, can kill any AD Carry very easily.
3. Coordination with allies and backdoors at Teamfights. AD Carry always stays behind his tank. But if someone backdoors him, enemy AD carry is almost surely died.

(Donīt tell any AD Carry that I revealed the secret!! xD)


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