Way of the Monkey King: Calling all Wukong players

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KillerQuiller

Senior Member

08-05-2012

Bump: I see +500 views on this thread, so I can't possibly be the only one interested in Wukong. That or people don't have any interest in helping others. Go figure.


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KillerQuiller

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Bump: +700 views, still nothing new. This isn't going away, too eager to learn. Will bump for years if I must.


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DeathWalker2250

Junior Member

08-06-2012

Just picked up Wukong.

I have to say...fun fun fun. I think he's my new favorite champ!


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KillerQuiller

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathWalker2250 View Post
Just picked up Wukong.

I have to say...fun fun fun. I think he's my new favorite champ!
I know right? I just constantly harass the enemy lane physically and mentally. Keep punishing them everytime they go for cs/their wave is low and mine isn't. For even more annoyance I have laugh keybinded to the mouse wheel so you can keep doing your obnoxious laugh in lane to upset people, making them do stupid things. Or atleast dread the lane phase. Thinking about getting a skin soon. Can't decide between Volcanic and Jade though. Both are pretty cool.


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The Genesis

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Switched to TW server and Wukong has always been my main since his release. I've complained a lot on how boring his kit is sometimes and how he is really out of place in current meta but I love so much on Riot's great work of his arts, personality, dance, skins and model so I hang on to him. I've played him almost 200 matches exclusively and probably more so I hope my insights could help you out when you enjoy him on top

K back to topic, Wukong in current meta only works on top. He can go mid against AP carry or jungle, but he falls short to the same disadvantages that there are better picks in those roles. (there are just too many junglers who clears faster and safer than him)

"My place is at the top!". In current meta, if you wants to be successful in top lane. You have to counter pick. That's the first basic rule. Win your lanes, farm, deny your opponents CS, dominate and snowball into late game is top lanes job. You are not going to be successful if you want to play Wukong top lane and don't have the mindset about champion counter pick. That's the first question you need to ask yourself when you pick Wukong. Forget about your E Q W combo and harass. If you are being counter picked .. you are going to feel useless in laning phase and wonder what you did wrong. So, know when is the best time to pick wukong is the first thing you should know before getting deep into masteries, runes and builds.

Ok, base on all that both players' skills are equal. If you are going to face those champion on top. You better not pick Wukong.
1. Malphite - A good malphite with a right build and mastery is just screaming counter to all AD top like Wukong. Your only chance of beating him is if he goes GP5 items first and you focus on damage. But once he got Chainmail he's going to out damage you.

2. Lee Sin - A good Lee Sin counters everything Wukong can throw at him. His Q does more damage than your Q, His E counters your decoy, and he has a shield and sustain. Can ult kick you or ports away if you decided to Ult. Just a very bad match up.

3. Singed - He's just gonna bully you and farm like no tomorrow and there's not much you can do. Except farming under your turret. If you can't put a decent pressure on your opponent you are already lost.


Judging from my experience, those 3 are the hardest counter to wukong. That the champion itself have the upper hand or kits that can shut Wukong down. The rest popular lineups... you are going to make a play depends on how you and your opponents play.


"Wukong has no sustain"
We know this and they know it too, and it hurts. I've tried building sustain items like Wiggles and Philos to some degree of success but I realised, I am heading a totally wrong direction. No matter how much sustain items that I build I will never out sustain Irelia or Olaf with the same item build because Wukong is never about sustain. He's about dealing tons of damage and generating enormous pressure during the laning phase instead of passively farm gold. So if you cannot maintain the pressure then you've already lost that advantage. So capitalise that early game damage if what Wukong should do if he's being picked.

Core Items
2 x Dorans
Brutaliser
(Hexdrinker - against Vlad and Rumble)
Boots

If you are last hitting well. You can get those items around level 8-9 even faster if you have kills. If you have those core completed and your opponent is building GP5 you can definitely wreck them from 80-0 with your full combo and ignite with maybe a little bit of chase, hell you can even wreck them if they got a chainmail. The only problem this build can't deal with successfully is probably a Garen or Renekton that goes giant belt and HoG as first item. But even that, you are generating much more damage than they do and much more terrifying in Dragon or jungle control (you can pretty much combo their AD carry from 100 to 0 at this stage of the game if you have a proper chance)


Mana Problem and Harass
It's just sad that when they have 5% of their health left and you are out of mana to finish them off. When you are playing Wukong, don't waste E on clear creep waves unless you want to push. A lot of new Wukong player plays Wukong wrong, they read guides and they think Wukong harass is all about E a Q W ... and then they fail miserably because they won't have enough mana to finish opponent off. The proper harass with Wukong is capitalise that attack speed buff E provides. When I am level 2 with E and Q. Depends on the match up (if they are not Riven, Garen or Darius) I will E >a> Q and then continue to auto attack to trade damage. Because I know, I will come out ahead with my attack speed buff. I've done most of my early game trading this way. Most of the time you won't even need W if you know what you are doing. What I mean is, bait their attacks first then go in and harass. Riven and Darius is a good example. If you see Riven used his shield and W missed you. That's the perfect time to use your E>a>Q aaaaa harass to trade ... that's so much more effective than E>a>Q>W.

As for Runes and masteries.
I go for 15AD damage red and quint, flat armor seal, mr/level glyph
19/11 for reduced minion damage since I do so much trading in lane (and it's so good when you need to freeze your lane)


Item Build order :
2 Dorans > Brutalizer > Phage > Then depends on team
Tanky build when your jungler/support is not a tank: FM then Warmog/Atmas
DMG build when there are other good initiator on your team: Bloodthirster GA MAW

Late game: Sell Brutalizer for Last Whisper
Banshee/Omen for Defense

I don't like TF on Wukong, it's a wonderful item but not what Wukong needs. You'd be better off buying all straight AD items that deals massive damage during your combo and ult.

Your job in team fight is easy, if you are in Tanky build, your job is to initiate and combo into your ult to hit as many people as possible then try to zone out their carry better to save W before you initiate. If you are in damage build, hide yourself in a near brush before team fight and try to find a perfect oppotunity to W yourself close enough into their carry and E Q R ignite on him. If you done it right, it's pretty much an instant kill on their carry or a forced flash.


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Keylogger

Member

08-06-2012

I build Wukong very tanky. I start off with boots 3 pots and build an early wriggle's for early damage and sustain. I then grab a warmogs for the mid game tankiness that you want. This is because you want to survive while getting in everyone's faces with your ult. Also it does plenty of damage at rank 2 and you'll find that you don't really need extra AD. At this point, proceed to build more tanky items depending on the situation, such as FoN, Frozen Heart, etc.

Personally I've found that building AD Wukong does not bring out the full potential of Wukong.

There are plenty of different fun combos that you can do with Wukong's skills. Here are a few:
-E, auto, Q, get out with W
-E, R, do whatever
-W from a bush, E, combo (this is usually done when enemies are low or during a gank)


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KillerQuiller

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Genesis View Post
Switched to TW server and Wukong has always been my main since his release. I've complained a lot on how boring his kit is sometimes and how he is really out of place in current meta but I love so much on Riot's great work of his arts, personality, dance, skins and model so I hang on to him. I've played him almost 200 matches exclusively and probably more so I hope my insights could help you out when you enjoy him on top

K back to topic, Wukong in current meta only works on top. He can go mid against AP carry or jungle, but he falls short to the same disadvantages that there are better picks in those roles. (there are just too many junglers who clears faster and safer than him)

"My place is at the top!". In current meta, if you wants to be successful in top lane. You have to counter pick. That's the first basic rule. Win your lanes, farm, deny your opponents CS, dominate and snowball into late game is top lanes job. You are not going to be successful if you want to play Wukong top lane and don't have the mindset about champion counter pick. That's the first question you need to ask yourself when you pick Wukong. Forget about your E Q W combo and harass. If you are being counter picked .. you are going to feel useless in laning phase and wonder what you did wrong. So, know when is the best time to pick wukong is the first thing you should know before getting deep into masteries, runes and builds.

Ok, base on all that both players' skills are equal. If you are going to face those champion on top. You better not pick Wukong.
1. Malphite - A good malphite with a right build and mastery is just screaming counter to all AD top like Wukong. Your only chance of beating him is if he goes GP5 items first and you focus on damage. But once he got Chainmail he's going to out damage you.

2. Lee Sin - A good Lee Sin counters everything Wukong can throw at him. His Q does more damage than your Q, His E counters your decoy, and he has a shield and sustain. Can ult kick you or ports away if you decided to Ult. Just a very bad match up.

3. Singed - He's just gonna bully you and farm like no tomorrow and there's not much you can do. Except farming under your turret. If you can't put a decent pressure on your opponent you are already lost.


Judging from my experience, those 3 are the hardest counter to wukong. That the champion itself have the upper hand or kits that can shut Wukong down. The rest popular lineups... you are going to make a play depends on how you and your opponents play.


"Wukong has no sustain"
We know this and they know it too, and it hurts. I've tried building sustain items like Wiggles and Philos to some degree of success but I realised, I am heading a totally wrong direction. No matter how much sustain items that I build I will never out sustain Irelia or Olaf with the same item build because Wukong is never about sustain. He's about dealing tons of damage and generating enormous pressure during the laning phase instead of passively farm gold. So if you cannot maintain the pressure then you've already lost that advantage. So capitalise that early game damage if what Wukong should do if he's being picked.

Core Items
2 x Dorans
Brutaliser
(Hexdrinker - against Vlad and Rumble)
Boots

If you are last hitting well. You can get those items around level 8-9 even faster if you have kills. If you have those core completed and your opponent is building GP5 you can definitely wreck them from 80-0 with your full combo and ignite with maybe a little bit of chase, hell you can even wreck them if they got a chainmail. The only problem this build can't deal with successfully is probably a Garen or Renekton that goes giant belt and HoG as first item. But even that, you are generating much more damage than they do and much more terrifying in Dragon or jungle control (you can pretty much combo their AD carry from 100 to 0 at this stage of the game if you have a proper chance)


Mana Problem and Harass
It's just sad that when they have 5% of their health left and you are out of mana to finish them off. When you are playing Wukong, don't waste E on clear creep waves unless you want to push. A lot of new Wukong player plays Wukong wrong, they read guides and they think Wukong harass is all about E a Q W ... and then they fail miserably because they won't have enough mana to finish opponent off. The proper harass with Wukong is capitalise that attack speed buff E provides. When I am level 2 with E and Q. Depends on the match up (if they are not Riven, Garen or Darius) I will E >a> Q and then continue to auto attack to trade damage. Because I know, I will come out ahead with my attack speed buff. I've done most of my early game trading this way. Most of the time you won't even need W if you know what you are doing. What I mean is, bait their attacks first then go in and harass. Riven and Darius is a good example. If you see Riven used his shield and W missed you. That's the perfect time to use your E>a>Q aaaaa harass to trade ... that's so much more effective than E>a>Q>W.

As for Runes and masteries.
I go for 15AD damage red and quint, flat armor seal, mr/level glyph
19/11 for reduced minion damage since I do so much trading in lane (and it's so good when you need to freeze your lane)


Item Build order :
2 Dorans > Brutalizer > Phage > Then depends on team
Tanky build when your jungler/support is not a tank: FM then Warmog/Atmas
DMG build when there are other good initiator on your team: Bloodthirster GA MAW

Late game: Sell Brutalizer for Last Whisper
Banshee/Omen for Defense

I don't like TF on Wukong, it's a wonderful item but not what Wukong needs. You'd be better off buying all straight AD items that deals massive damage during your combo and ult.

Your job in team fight is easy, if you are in Tanky build, your job is to initiate and combo into your ult to hit as many people as possible then try to zone out their carry better to save W before you initiate. If you are in damage build, hide yourself in a near brush before team fight and try to find a perfect oppotunity to W yourself close enough into their carry and E Q R ignite on him. If you done it right, it's pretty much an instant kill on their carry or a forced flash.
First of all I would like to thank you for your post. You took the time to sit down and educate another fellow Wukong player. I agree with most of your post and I already do most of these things like sneaking up on the carry in dmg build to force flash on them or outright kill them.

A few questions. One you mentioned some strong counters like Lee Sin and Malphite which in theory I would dread very much, however you didn't list any champions that Wukong himself counters, just champions that you shouldnt bring Wukong in to fight. Also on the counter list I imagine Darius is another PITA because I hear (havent confirmed), that his passive reveals Wukong when hes doing his Decoy, so Wukong would have to win the fight or Darius will just wait for you to Decoy, grab the true Wukong, then beat you down till nuke.

Also while you mention Dorans into Brut into Phage, do you agree that if you are somehow losing lane or you just get counter picked somehow, that Wriggles would then become something that he should purchase or stick to Dorans then bulk up on resistances and HP?

Thank you for your time and I hope that we can discuss further about Wukong top lane.


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Entravity

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Senior Member

08-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerQuiller View Post
First of all I would like to thank you for your post. You took the time to sit down and educate another fellow Wukong player. I agree with most of your post and I already do most of these things like sneaking up on the carry in dmg build to force flash on them or outright kill them.

A few questions. One you mentioned some strong counters like Lee Sin and Malphite which in theory I would dread very much, however you didn't list any champions that Wukong himself counters, just champions that you shouldnt bring Wukong in to fight. Also on the counter list I imagine Darius is another PITA because I hear (havent confirmed), that his passive reveals Wukong when hes doing his Decoy, so Wukong would have to win the fight or Darius will just wait for you to Decoy, grab the true Wukong, then beat you down till nuke.

Also while you mention Dorans into Brut into Phage, do you agree that if you are somehow losing lane or you just get counter picked somehow, that Wriggles would then become something that he should purchase or stick to Dorans then bulk up on resistances and HP?

Thank you for your time and I hope that we can discuss further about Wukong top lane.
Darius passive does not reveal champions afflicted with it.
If it did that'd be broken.


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KillerQuiller

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by iGintoki View Post
Darius passive does not reveal champions afflicted with it.
If it did that'd be broken.
Thats good to hear. Glad someone cleared that up. Never mind the Darius bit then.


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BloodRa1n

Junior Member

08-06-2012

I bought Wukong a few days ago and he has quickly become my new favorite champ. I've played like 20ish games with him and only lost two of them, but even the games I lost I typically maintained very good scores. As far as my build goes, my general one would look like is:
Boots + 3 pots
2 dorans
Ugrade boots to either tabi or mercs.
Phage/ hexdrinker depending on who i'm up against top lane
Giants belt into warmogs, however you can pick a randuins if you prefer that instead
Turn phage itno tri force or hexdrinker into maw. However I always get a Tri force on Wu.
Atmas or GA
An AD damage item (Usually a bloodthirster)

I'd only consider a wriggles if I was doing extremely bad in lane.

You always want a tri force on wu instead on building purely ad items. The sheen proc from Tri works extremely well with his E + Q combo and the bonus movement speed allows you to chase and cover a bit more distance when escaping with your clone.

As far as his counters go, I say Yorick or Lee Sin are his biggest, and Irelia if you don't play well. In addition, champions who are naturally very tanky such as malphite or singed counter him pretty hard so if you see any of them picked for top lane, don't pick wukong

Double dorans gives me enough lifesteal to sustain inand I usually buy 2 pots any time I recall, if I have ran out of the 3 I initially started with.
When laning with Wukong, I disagree with what The Genesis said. I think that what you typically want to take as little damage as possible when playing wukong since he has no natural sustain, so yes do the typical E Q W combo. However use he combo wisely as it does consume a lot of mana. If you do find youself having mana problems though, buy mana pots. Occasionally I even star with boots 2 health pots and 1 mana pot if I plan on really harassing the hell out of my enemy.

Also, I think the most important part of laning wukong is using his w smartly. For example when I lane against a jax or a panth, time your w so when either of them try to jump on you, the hit you clone instead of you. In response, you can either choose to keep running or E + Q them. Most likely if you E Q them in response they will back off and you will win the trade

Typically when I lane I try to harass the enemy as much as possible. E + Q or autoattack whenever you can without putting yourself in danger. The trick with wukong is to try and force your enemy to recall as much as possible to put yourself at an advantage because since wukong has no sustain, taking too long in lane isn't the best thing for him.

Thats pretty much it for me.