Is AS/AP viable; A serious question.

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Smittens91

Senior Member

04-07-2013

So I've been playing LoL for just over a year now and while I'm very far from any serious level of play (Silver 2, hold your applause), I would like to think I have a reasonable grasp of the basics. One thing that has been plauging me though is getting an Attack Speed Ability Power build to work. I've played Teemo. I've tried out Kayle a few times. Even went so far as using AS/AP builds on TF and Varus (the latter of which is insanely eyebrow raising once farmed) but in the end it just feels like trying to fill the role of an adc without quite making it.

In my mind, the adc has two main roles: Providing consistent, reliable damage in teamfights regardless of CDs or Mana, and taking down towers quickly during a seige. Again, I am still considered noobish so there is likely more that I am missing. However, I look at those reasons, I see a large amount of physical (read: tower-taking) damage dealers heading mid, and I think to myself: Why not have someone do that, but with magical damage? You know, in case you still have a Fighter top lane with Talon mid. But it doesnt seem to work that easily..

Most adcs will start with damage first; in small trades and exchanges attack speed remains mostly irrelevant. I see this and try to copy with building AP before AS. The result is.. lackluster. I've tried building a Pickaxe into Guinsoo's, and while it is kind of nice once it stacks, it still feels sub par to an adc with a BT even without factoring in life gain. Could it be the build is just a slower ramp than normal? I'm not sure.

It really seems like it *should* work, considering there being an ample amount of itemazation possible for the stats, but nothing seems to be working well.

TLDR: I want an AS/AP champion who works in place of an adc, without feeling completely gimped if not insanely fed. Any help?

P.S. Yes, I know melee champions are not reliable during turret sieges, but in my bracket there doesnt seem to be many instances where we actually siege. Rather it is winning a teamfight and then pushing a defenseless tower, in which case Talon/Zed/Panth would work fine.


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Sephïroth

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Senior Member

04-08-2013

It depends on who, honestly. Kayle and Teemo are the only two who can make use of it.

You're right, compared to an ADC the overall damage output is "meh". The difference is Kayle and Teemo have a crapton of burst and utility, while still doing damage. Ezreal is just damage.

If you're looking to "Replace" the damage of an ADC, you're not going to do it. Crits are why ADC's do so much damage.

Its about what each champion has to offer, yes it is quite viable. Kayle and Teemo have game breaking mechanics(Screw your god damn ultimate Kayle.).

Teemo is fine without being fed, but Kayle generally has a lack luster early game until she gets level 6 and can bait bad fights and still win. Even then she needs items to do damage.

The fact is Kayle and Teemo both need money to do a lot of damage, but so do ADCs.


Attack speed in general is just a damage multiplier and is usually only good when its a 1v1 scenario, or a clean up scenario. Not saying don't get it, just realize raw damage is very important.

Honestly, if I were you: I'd keep playing Kayle, as a good Kayle can carry any game. She can either do tons of damage to win the game, or keep the ADC Alive in the middle of an epic team fight. If you pop that ult when 3 people dive an ADC, those 3 people are now out of position and are taking constant DPS.

You are still in Silver, so there is about a 50/50 shot he's not any good. That's when your judgement comes into play when to use your ultimate.

All in all, yes they are really viable. Teemo is just annoying but his troll antics make winning a game really hard. He eliminates the ability to clean up team fights. Unless you have great CC to keep the enemy team from running, he will just make every team fight seem like a small win. Honestly, very demoralizing. A Hidden utility of the little rat.


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tAki 183

Member

04-08-2013

How stupid would it be if the opposing team had Vayne as an ADC top and some APC (the way you're describing it) bot? It would be horrid (for the team against this set-up).

It's too easy to abuse.


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Warrrrax

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Senior Member

04-08-2013

No, its just not viable anymore. Your main contenders would be Kayle and Kog and Lulu. Mainly Kog really since Kayle is more for midlane and Lulu supports. They dont pull off ADC very well.

The main problems are:

a) Harder to last hit. Rushing AD and having AD runes,etc makes last hit way easier.

b) Weaker harass. In lane you only get in 1 hit in most cases. Better to hit slow but hard rather than faster but weaker.

c) NO LIFESTEAL. This is a big one. Lifesteal is hugely gimped with AS/onhit.

d) Only TWO stats to multiply DPS instead of 3. This is the main issue really. Eventually with IE/PD, you are critting half teh time to do 250% damage. That is a big bonus multipler and very efficient!
Esp once you have some 300 AD and 2.0 AS with steroid. It is WAY cheaper to get crit and multiply your huge damage, rather than pile on more AD/AS.

e) Crappy itemization. Wits end sucks. Malady sucks. Sword of divine is gone (in its orig form), no more ionic zapper.

f) AS now costs MORE than in S2, whereas AD is cheaper. Another huge blow in S3.


Add all this up and you have a reciple for failure. Sorry man. I loved Kog AS/onhit back in the day, but it sucks now.


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OriginalJack

Senior Member

04-08-2013

It can work on certain champs but it doesn't replace the need for a legit ADC because late late game it just can't put out the same kind of numbers as an ADC.

But it can replace the APC and be effective and the only difference is the instead of AP burst you have sustained AP damage.


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lolconk

Senior Member

04-09-2013

TF used to work okayish. malady, wits end, sotd, madred bloodrazors was ripping tankys appart at 2.5 AS. Add the E 4rth attack ap dmg from TF and it was scrolling dmg numbers on top of their heads like crazy. Stun for free AAs. Cant recall what was the last item ... triforce, gunblade or something.


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Akromah

Senior Member

04-09-2013

Lulu is extremely viable if you build her like this provided the matchup is right for it. She counters a lot of lanes...is extremely hard to gank...kites like a champ and provides amazing utility in the team fight. I've played in plenty of plat/diamond games where this lulu build holds her own.