If you believe turtling is an issue, you're doing it wrong.

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Zionyx

Senior Member

07-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by E1C View Post
There is truly nothing wrong with the turret. And turtling is honestly not a good strategy. It's only good against teams who don't understand why it exists on 3v3 and why you shouldn't let it happen.

I will quickly explain why:

By playing the game like it's 5v5 (i.e rushing to destroy inhibitors if you can) you are screwing yourself over.

Big reasons why you destroy the inhibitor in 5v5 is so that you can safely get baron / dragon while they defend their base. And with 5 people that global gold is worth more than the amount of gold the other team can get while farming ONE of three lanes.

In 3v3, all you can really do while they defend is take dragon, and for a quite a while after that they will be getting more gold / xp than you are. As such, it is wise if you are ahead to extend the lane phase and farm up rather than take the inhibitor.

The only time that is a good time to destroy the enemy's inhibitor is when you can push their nexus turret and DOWN IT. If all 3 of your team members die in exchange to destroy their nexus turret, you're doing fine. As long as the other team can't destroy your nexus turret in the time that your team is down, (I'm assuming they got a few towers to go through if you've already pushed into their base), then you can literally just rush the nexus afterwards and auto attack it for the win. Downing the nexus turret basically secures the game.

However, if you kill the inhibitor and are unable to destroy the nexus turret, you messed up.

TL;DR It's your fault for destroying the inhibitor prematurely, not the maps fault.
I think that if destroying an inhibitor is counter-productive, the map design has flaws.


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Eryn

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Senior Member

07-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zionyx View Post
I think that if destroying an inhibitor is counter-productive, the map design has flaws.
What is a design flaw though?

If a General doesn't engage in a war until his entire army has arrived, is this a tactical flaw?

If you and your teammates wait until your farm has amassed to charge the enemies base, is that really a design flaw, or just a tactic?


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Zionyx

Senior Member

07-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by E1C View Post
What is a design flaw though?

If a General doesn't engage in a war until his entire army has arrived, is this a tactical flaw?

If you and your teammates wait until your farm has amassed to charge the enemies base, is that really a design flaw, or just a tactic?
It is a better strategy to hold killing the inhibitors until you are ready to finish the game.

I just beleive it wasn't mean to be that way, killing an inhibitor without finishing the game at the moment is just an advantage for the enemy team.

I beleive it should not be.


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Eryn

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Senior Member

07-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zionyx View Post
It is a better strategy to hold killing the inhibitors until you are ready to finish the game.

I just beleive it wasn't mean to be that way, killing an inhibitor without finishing the game at the moment is just an advantage for the enemy team.

I beleive it should not be.
Okay, I think I understand what you are saying.

a) The way the map is designed, destroying the inhibitor prematurely is not a good strategy.
b) As such, it leads to longer, less fun games.
c) Anything that makes the games less fun constitutes as a design flaw.
d) Therefore a is a design flaw.

Makes sense.

Edit: I am serious when I say it makes sense. Although at the same time I have no idea how to keep the (3v3) map centered around team fighting, jungle control, and ganking, while simultaneously making the map larger to prohibit turtling.


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Sam

Senior Member

07-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by E1C View Post
Okay, I think I understand what you are saying.

a) The way the map is designed, destroying the inhibitor prematurely is not a good strategy.
b) As such, it leads to longer, less fun games.
c) Anything that makes the games less fun constitutes as a design flaw.
d) Therefore a is a design flaw.

Makes sense.
He said nothing about "making it fun" o.o He just saying the game probably wasn't meant for the turtling to ever happen. :P


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Eryn

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Senior Member

07-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Såm View Post
He said nothing about "making it fun" o.o He just saying the game probably wasn't meant for the turtling to ever happen. :P
I thought that what constituted a design flaw was less fun?

I also am not sure how to design a 3v3 map where turtling doesn't exist, while ganking, and team fighting does.

If the map was larger to stop turtling, team fighting wouldn't happen as often. Ganking wouldn't be as effective. The game all around would be slower until the very end where turtling wouldn't happen.


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Sam

Senior Member

07-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by E1C View Post
I thought that what constituted a design flaw was less fun?

I also am not sure how to design a 3v3 map where turtling doesn't exist, while ganking, and team fighting does.

If the map was larger to stop turtling, team fighting wouldn't happen as often. Ganking wouldn't be as effective. The game all around would be slower until the very end where turtling wouldn't happen.
Mhm. Rarely see turtling anymore. It's a dumb concept.


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IS148a223fc86b1c4fb2104

Senior Member

07-23-2012

Someone made the proposition to switch nexus tower with nexus itself. As a result you wouldn't be able to drag minions waves in the fountain and defend tower at the same time anymore, and the tower would still be close enough from the fountain to prevent backdoor.


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408

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Member

07-23-2012

Turtling does not exist, when you get inhibitors you get the whole jungle/dragon/red, with those buffs you can fight under their lone nexus tower..


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Goggris

Senior Member

07-23-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zionyx View Post
I think that if destroying an inhibitor is counter-productive, the map design has flaws.
Deja vu! I made this exact argument to E1C last night.

Sorry E1C, 2v1, we win.