A map idea involving more than just a generic request

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McDerp

Member

06-10-2012

omg yaay this thread is LIVE!

Regarding a teleporting shen while he's carrying the flag: no teleports, b's or flashes while you have the flag. think of it in terms of buffs/debuffs the flag could add on to the champ who's carrying it.


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DonnFirinne

Senior Member

06-10-2012

I'm back, and I've read through everything new, but there's so much it's going to take me some time to address is all. First, I would like to thank everyone who stayed to discuss the map while I was gone. I was extremely happy to see it still high on the first page. I've seen a lot of good ideas, and I will get a response post up (maybe more than one) as soon as I can.


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DonnFirinne

Senior Member

06-10-2012

I'm hoping to reference everyone when I use their ideas, but I'm having trouble keeping track so if I forget to cite you, let me know.

Teleportation This has been given so much attention over the weekend that I think my first step should be to remove the Summoner Spell Teleport because long distance travel is just too powerful in this game. And I might as well say no recalling with the flag too. For teleportation by champion abilities, I have already decided that ultimates cannot be used while holding the flag, and I think that that stipulation covers every long-range movement ability in the game (correct me if I'm wrong).
Flash and Related Abilities Flashing while you have the flag is fine. I will take a good hard look at all the wall thicknesses when I redraw the map (haven't started yet, but I will) and make sure nobody can just flash a couple times and be at the enemy base.
Flag Reset I was definitely already planning this after any time the flag dropped, but I guess I hadn't mentioned it yet. I'll be sure to add in in the update.
Minions Reaching the End I like TeknoWizard's idea of giving gold for each minion that reaches the enemy base. This gives a reason for pushing the lanes hard as well as counterpushing without making it a viable way to rack up points.
Flag Carrier Buff/Debuff wickedsiik mentioned the carrier having less time on debuffs. This made me think that maybe putting Tenacity on the flag could work as a buff that couldn't be abused. Add in the MS debuff included in the last update and I think it sounds pretty close to what we want. If anything maybe a slight (couple percent) reduction on damage dealt? What does everyone think about these ideas?
2 Flags/Flags in Enemy Base I thought about 2 flag originally, and my idea was a single lane, with the flags on opposite sides of the lane in the middle. I didn't like the two options, because either it would be too easy to counter-capture the enemy flag or it would be essentially the same as having one. I don't like flags in the enemy base the get take back to yours because it's much much harder to defend against that. With it in the middle, your team can recall to defend your base if you can't contest it, but not if they're in your base to begin with.
Monster Guards I think the matter has already been settled, but I want to set my idea straight. With the one flag in the center circle, I envision that area being a place for a large teamfight over the flag, and with a monster there that just won't work.
Kills Giving Points I want kills to give points as a way to deter a team from suiciding into the enemy base to capture the flag. I understand that kills shouldn't be priority in a CTF game, but I think adjusting the points per capture and points to win are a better way to achieve both goals.
Nexus I admit nexuses seem to be pretty important to have in League maps, and Riot will probably want them involved to keep with the lore and all, and that's fine if the nexuses for this map are like Dominion nexuses where only certain actions on the field can influence them, not direct attacks. If minions could attack the nexus, then champions probably could too (it would only make sense that way) and then you open up a whole aspect of the game that doesn't fit with the feel of everything else you're doing.
Verandure's Map You are right that this thread isn't necessarily the right place to post this, but don't feel bad. Instead you should start your own thread so that you can have your own feedback and you can develop your map as I'm developing mine. I think you have a unique idea and you should put it out for people to see. If you do, post a link here and I'll come give you my feedback and encourage those who visit here to check yours out as well.
Stealth I think I already said this, but holding the flag will break/prevent all stealth. That's all I'll say about that until the stealth rework happens.
New Defensive Summoner Spells Can you think of anything specifically that would work, Xinnk?

Wow that was a lot. I have to thank you all again, and especially Lasie and TeknoWizard, who seem to have taken a keen interest in this map and have given a lot of great help. I'm going to put off updating the original post for a while, but I'll try to get it done tonight. It will be a few days, maybe even a week, before the updated map gets fully drawn, much less uploaded, so keep the feedback on other things flowing in until then.


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TeknoWizard

Senior Member

06-10-2012

So. Since everyone agrees that kills shouldn't be made the big deal about this map, yet we need rewards for kills, AND I've been playing Halo: Reach again, I got a new idea.

We want everyone to be encouraged to go to the middle, fight, then basically run back to their base. So I was figuring this. Instead of killing someone then simply getting a point, how about we make something along the lines of when you kill someone, YOU get a point. You will have this point held on you, sort of like a killing spree. Then when you return to your "nexus", or whatever the capture point is, you channel for a bit, and THEN transfer your points into your team's total. This will discourage wild suicides after mopping up a team fight. And if they kill the person with the points, they are lost. I guess this might encourage more of a "hit and run" style of killing the other team, if that's what everyone wants from this. For big teamfights, then nevermind on this idea.

For summoners, I think that a "reveal" spell would be nice. Sort of like the first part of Twisted Fate's ult. Almost CV, except only shows player's location, yet nothing around them. This way you could better set up ambushes in the swamp area, which to me, would be awesome to see. I guess it would be overpowered, but a "lockdown" spell would be nice. It roots the flag in place for a second or two. This wouldn't work when a player is carrying it, but when it's dropped/on the spawn point for it.

Also about picking up the flag. Is it just, "Run through it, and you pick it up"? Because to prevent ninja grabs, I think a channel time would be needed, like how you capture a flag on Dominion.


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DonnFirinne

Senior Member

06-10-2012

@TeknoWizard
I'm gonna update soon, so what I put here will be included, but I feel like running through this response pretty quick.
Very interesting idea for points, but with all the global objectives to fight over (3+) I think big team fights will be pretty common.
Yes there will be a channel time to take the flag, I'm thinking 15-30 seconds right now.
I do like the Reveal idea, but the lockdown idea seems a little strong.


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TeknoWizard

Senior Member

06-10-2012

Really trivial question time.

1: What biome is it? Forest? Desert?

2: Mind posting to tell us when you've updated the OP?


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DonnFirinne

Senior Member

06-10-2012

I actually just updated the OP a minute ago. Each time I do I'll be sure to bump the thread and change the date at the top.

Well, with the widely varying biomes in Valoran, it could be anything. If the swamp idea goes through then there would have to be something related. Perhaps this map could be set in the Plague Jungles?


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Phear3d

Member

06-10-2012

I would suggest moving the Major Buffs into where you have the Minor Buffs at the moment. You don't want to reward passive play, especially on Capture the Flag. I feel like it would be frustrating to have safe junglers coming out and stomping on you anytime you go for the flag. If they want a major buff there should be a risk associated with it.


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TeknoWizard

Senior Member

06-10-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonnFirinne View Post
I actually just updated the OP a minute ago. Each time I do I'll be sure to bump the thread and change the date at the top.

Well, with the widely varying biomes in Valoran, it could be anything. If the swamp idea goes through then there would have to be something related. Perhaps this map could be set in the Plague Jungles?
It could be in Ionia. Like, one of the parts that was wrecked by Noxus.


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Forwyn

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Member

06-10-2012

Cool idea. My main problem is that there are 8 champs with blinks, many that are central to their builds - though some of them are ults, some, like Ezreal, Talon, and LeBlanc, are not.