Another Fundamental Flaw In The Elo System

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Axecution

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Senior Member

08-09-2010

So upon contemplation I have discovered yet another flaw in the elo system,

The basis behind the elo system is that it's a measure of individual skill against other players. The way elo shifts is by moving from loser to victor. Essentially based on this logic in order to gain elo you should be better than your 'opponent' and since you have 5 seperate opponents you should only have to be better than 3/5 of your opponents in order to gain elo (of course this is based on the notion that elo is a measure of individual skill).

Now here is where we run into a problem. Even if your individual skill is better than 5/5 of your oppoents you could still suffer a defeat resulting in lost elo.

I don't understand how this system stays in place considering it's laden with logical flaws.

EDIT:
Since some people don't get it. The logical flaw is in the concept of elos being based on individual skill level in relation to ones opposition. This becomes erroneous when you take into consideration that in order to gain elo one should be better than the mean skill level of the opposition.


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Burning Rose

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Senior Member

08-09-2010

"Discovered".

As though 1000 people haven't brought this up before.


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Zealot573

Member

08-09-2010

They won't make money developing a proper system.

So don't expect them to fix it.


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ReverendSchu

Senior Member

08-09-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Axecution View Post
So upon contemplation I have discovered yet another flaw in the elo system,

The basis behind the elo system is that it's a measure of individual skill against other players. The way elo shifts is by moving from loser to victor. Essentially based on this logic in order to gain elo you should be better than your 'opponent' and since you have 5 seperate opponents you should only have to be better than 3/5 of your opponents in order to gain elo (of course this is based on the notion that elo is a measure of individual skill).

Now here is where we run into a problem. Even if your individual skill is better than 5/5 of your oppoents you could still suffer a defeat resulting in lost elo.

I don't understand how this system stays in place considering it's laden with logical flaws.
WOW, I've never seen this thread before!


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Mordwyrhta

Senior Member

08-09-2010

Take into account that leading a pub is a skill.

Making other players follow you and listen is a skill.

Helping others fix bad build choices is a skill.

Increase those skills and you'll find yourself winning more and getting a higher ELO.

Being a one man wonderkid isn't that useful. Being a team player who is capable of making your other team mates better, now THAT is useful.

Instead of raging on your bad team mates, take the time to explain why they're doing badly. Do it calmly and respectfully. Don't say "Your build sucks" try "I get what you're trying to accomplish, but have you considered this?"

A million super soldiers aren't worth a single good leader.


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Wingflier

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Senior Member

08-09-2010

The system is fine. It isn't perfect, no system is perfect, and whatever they do there will always be flaws.

Do you sometimes lose ELO even though you were a better player than the entire enemy team? Sure. But occasionally, you win ELO when you are worse than the entire enemy team.

The system is about balance and trials, over a period of time, it will find the ELO that you belong at. The people who complain about the system are the people who don't want to admit that it works, and are suffering from Illusory Superiority.


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Saffire

Senior Member

08-09-2010

You're assuming that if you're better than your opponent, you will always win and therefore gain Elo. That is simply not true, even 1v1.


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gowfaec

Senior Member

08-09-2010

Oh look, it's this thread again.

You are wrong. 100%. Nothing you said was right, or will every be right. Please go back, think about it for a little while, eat some tuna, finish renovating your patio, then come back when you realized how wrong and misleading you are, and apologize.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingflier View Post
The system is fine. It isn't perfect, no system is perfect, and whatever they do there will always be flaws.

Do you sometimes lose ELO even though you were a better player than the entire enemy team? Sure. But occasionally, you win ELO when you are worse than the entire enemy team.

The system is about balance and trials, over a period of time, it will find the ELO that you belong at. The people who complain about the system are the people who don't want to admit that it works, and are suffering from Illusory Superiority.
+1. Also, if you are better then your Elo, you will win more then you lose on average, climb up in ranking until you are at your proper(ish) Elo, and stay there until you get better. Played 100 games and you're rank 1200? Sorry to break it to you, but you're 1200 Elo.


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Presenc3

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Senior Member

08-09-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saffire View Post
You're assuming that if you're better than your opponent, you will always win and therefore gain Elo. That is simply not true, even 1v1.
the Yankees are a better team than the Orioles... do the Yankees always win?

Pres, sports analogy to the rescue!


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Brokenhope

Senior Member

08-09-2010

the system stays in place because the average LoL player is supposed to win half of their games. Better players win more, sucky players win less. Just play the **** game, you will end up where you need to be.


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