Are the nuke heroes too weak early game?

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Prisonal

Senior Member

10-22-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by GNOY View Post
I must say, that I stopped reading this after this line. No offence.

This


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Tiklmesilly

Senior Member

10-22-2009

Annie is a great hero early mid game and still a good hero late game.
i dont feel she needs any changes.... except maybe tibers getting like 5-10% of your AP added to his dmg or attack speed cause late game i just use him for the summoning dmg.

also annie is easy to play just last hit minions early game for money it doesnt cost any mp if you do it right. not to mention she has one of the highes armor/lvl of any champ in the game makeing her quite survivable.

i think most of the nuke classes are fine though i think a few small tweaks here and there could help them but thats for each hero not a thing as a whole.


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IgnisPhase1

Member

10-22-2009

Some nukers could probably use increased AP scaling. Anivia gets full AP from a double Flash Frost, and full AP from a chill-hit Frostbite. Anivia with AP hits like a truck all the way into endgame with just two spells. In team fights, you can Frostbite twice while someone is sitting/stunned/snared/stuck/walled in Glacial Storm too.

That's a lot of bonus from AP.


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GNOY

Senior Member

10-22-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyllyn View Post
I'm wrong about fairly deadly, aren't i
Its just I saw many good replays with Lina, from championships etc. Sorry for maybe being too rude. Ofc, Lion is preferred more frequently (they are kinda similar in functionality, but Lion has more of disable).


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SlyGoat

Member

10-22-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by GNOY View Post
Its just I saw many good replays with Lina, from championships etc. Sorry for maybe being too rude. Ofc, Lion is preferred more frequently (they are kinda similar in functionality, but Lion has more of disable).
Lina was a serious monster back in the olden days before blink dagger was nerfed. Gave her incredible ganking power and survivability; but she already had fairly decent ganking power and the nerf robbed her survivability so it hurt hard. Lion is better just for more/more reliable disable, yeah. And siphon mana gives him infinite harass with minimal item investment. 'course he's been nerfed a lot.

Casters are better late game in LoL and DPSers are better early game. The goal was to make all characters viable all game and eliminate the "carry" mentality, which is good and they did pretty well IMHO. Casters are fine.


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GNOY

Senior Member

10-23-2009

Well, in DotA - only way to improve your damage on spells - is Aghanim (only for ULT) and some damage amplifying spells. But in LoL you can get 1000 AP with Veigar and see how opponents die in one spell combo - something unachievable in DotA late game.


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seresibyl

Senior Member

10-23-2009

I personally don't find Annie weak.

She certainly doesn't have the 3 hits you're dead nuke until after level 6, but from level 6 to about level 13~ she's pretty darn bursty. Even after that, depending on your runes/items, you can still be bursty.

She also has AoE stuns. X)

She's pretty decent -- and they made her even more decent (aka awesome) when they upped her scaling.


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TenToedPete1

Adjudicator

10-23-2009

Lina is strong early game, and only useful if you manage to get a lot of kills, or farm a lot for end game (not very often in competitive games). Annie can put out enough damage early game, and still be powerful late game. If annie were as (near) useless as lina late game, then yes, i would agree early game nukes should be more powerful to compensate, but at the current rate where end game nukes can hit very hard (and with annie, you are constantly casting, with a 4 second or less disintegrate cooldown).

Furthmore, your assumption on the damage annie can deal compared to lina at level 9 is wrong. Lina is, as you say, able to unload 900ish damage of burst, and may even get off an auto attack during the duration of her stun, putting the damage a tiny bit higher. A good annie is going to have stun up to start with, drop tibbers, who will continue to attack and burn the target with his aoe immolate while the target is stunned. Additionally, you assumed annie would max disintigrate before incinerate. I myself never do this, but it may be common for others, im not sure. Doing this will lower your potential burst damage by a little over 65 (as incinerate has a slightly better AP ratio).

Overall, i disagee with your analysis


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