16 Tips for Xin: An Informal Guide

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Animus

Senior Member

08-16-2010

Get something like an Atma's maybe? At least for me at level 18 with a Frozen Mallet and no health runes, I have like 2711 health, so with Atma's that translates to another ~50 or 60 AD in addition to 45 armor and 18% crit.


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DDR16

Junior Member

08-16-2010

Anybody else do R > E> W> Q

I have found the charge to be devastating early and mid game


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hu4rollz

Senior Member

08-16-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Detharis View Post
I started playing a few days back and bough xin after researching almost EVERY SINGLE OTHER PERSON. Reading this article led me to believe im doing something wrong though.
My typical leveling is R>W>E>Q only because i use my rotation as Q>E>R>W and then it kinda depends from there. Most people usually die because i play a more hit and run style, ive done very well with this against many tank classes that stacked DEF and HP alike. Also it demolishes DPS/Casters, my only problem is CC but its to be expected.

Usually my item lineup starts with Doran's Shield (i dont grab the hp pot because most of my opponents atm suck.) After that im confused as where to go, i get malady if i find myself in 1v2 because the hp gained from E>R>W>Q usually keeps me at max HP making R do max damage. If im not in that situation i usually build to the Phantom Dancer, since, imo, it works well with both the passive, making me a beefy tank, or when im pushing to take out a tower, i have that much more to play with. Then i usually get my upgraded boots, usually i grab Mercury's Treads since CC is a problem. And then from there im at a loss, i sometimes grab phage if im in lategame and i need to gank some casters to support other lanes, but usually i dont know what to grab. I can almost NEVER EVER get to the point where i can actually make Banshee's Viel so i dont even try anymore, i know it helps against CC but i cant farm up the cash to get it.

So, you guys tell me, what am i doing right, what am i doing wrong?

I only really have a problem when outnumbered, but i usually wouldnt engage anyways. The only other issue is slow play at lvl 1-3 till i can actually combo attacks, but thats to be expected.


Also i never eally found out when was the best time to creep, i usually am preoccupied by other champs trying to take out towers or coming in my lane to farm. I mean if im low on cash ill take out just about every camp for that extra, but it doesnt really help at higher levels besides the obvious buffs. Also we never take out Dragon or Worm, most people are too dumb or foreign to understand that the buff is really strong.
I think the HP pot is especially important against weaker players. Think of it as a licensee to be aggressive. It is very hard to harass with xin without taking some damage, so the more damage you can regenerate, the more often you can harass. Xin is a very good harasser, especially when leveling E and not pushing (which I highly recommend).

Starks is pretty much always better than malady, although malady isn't actually a bad item on Xin (despite its mostly deserved reputation).

Phantom Dancer isn't a bad item on Xin, but I think there are better choices especially early game.

My standard advice is doran's shield > boots > (last whisper/wit's end/starks) > boots 2 > phage > game dependent defensive item > totally depends.

Don't fight neutral creeps unless you have nothing else to do, with the exception being getting buffs. Unless someone else on your team needs them (which is pretty often the case in better games but rarely in noob games), you should always be getting the buffs when you can.


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hu4rollz

Senior Member

08-16-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miirshak View Post
i too could use some help with my Xin build...

atm i go something like:

- Dorians shield + pot
- boots 1 and brutalizer
- boots of swiftness and phage
- yuumo ghostblade and frozen mallet
- IE

once i have the 3 core items, yuumo, frozen mallet and boots, i generally do very well in terms of dmg dealing and survivability... but this only works if my team is worth a ****... and of late, this tends to be a problem :P
So what should i do to make my build even more survivable without gimping dmg output?
I recommend against boots of swiftness. Merc Treads are better for staying in the fight and with 21 in defense (I'm with Phreak on this one... "get 21 in defense on all melee heroes") Ninja Tabi are better for escaping. I actually think Zerker's treads are viable in certain instances on Xin as well, and if you want to stick to this item build you might be surprised how well they work with it since you are lacking attack speed. I would get any of those three over boots of swiftness.

Which brings me to my next piece of advice... You get no attack speed with this build at all until you spend well over 4500, and that's only the proc on ghostblade. You have no real attack speed in over 10000 worth of items. I'm guessing you are leveling W over either Q or E to compensate? I recommend getting an attack speed item to make up for W and leveling E > Q for better overall damage output and more frequent and better slows/stuns.

If you still want to get brutalizer early I recommend Stark's after it. With some armor pen runes (which you should have) this means you will be doing close to true damage on anyone without armor items. Armor pen is most cost effective when you are getting opponents armor near 0. Also with Stark's the lifesteal gives you survivability and you need the attack speed.


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hu4rollz

Senior Member

08-16-2010

Quote:
but this only works if my team is worth a ****
I want to address this line real quick. I think that going a build this DPS heavy on Xin can lead to what I call "my team sucks" syndrom. Here's one way it can happen: you go dps and do alright, but your team is struggling a bit. You can beat anyone 1v1 cause you are dps Xin. In team fights you do a ****load of damage, but you immediately draw focus and can't last long. You are definitely "doing your part" since you do so much damage and force them to focus you. But as soon as you die the rest of your team quickly lose the now 4v5 fight. Or another: you wait to engage because you don't want to get focused, and then someone on your team gets initiated on, people try to run, and you never have a chance to really do anything. Maybe you take down most of a tanks health before you both run or you take out one of their dps before dying. In both scenarios it is mostly your team's fault.

In games like these, I think there is a far better way to carry your team. Get some cheap-ish DPS items early, when fights are mostly smaller numbers, and then transition into more of a tank build. This way you can still be an anti-carry with good AE damage, but you will hold the other team's fire a lot longer and have the ability to initiate. The best way to help out a struggling player is to make the fight easy for them. You are Xin, so you will attract attention no matter what. The more aggressively you can play, and the longer you can hold opponent's attention, the easier you make the fight for your teammates.

A lot of people think "my team sucks, I need to get damage and carry" where I think with Xin the opposite is usually true. Go DPS only with good teams, and survivability after some DPS to carry bad teams.


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hu4rollz

Senior Member

08-16-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
Get something like an Atma's maybe? At least for me at level 18 with a Frozen Mallet and no health runes, I have like 2711 health, so with Atma's that translates to another ~50 or 60 AD in addition to 45 armor and 18% crit.
Atma's is a great item on Xin if you have good HP late game and want to add some damage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DDR16 View Post
Anybody else do R > E> W> Q

I have found the charge to be devastating early and mid game
I like Q>W because it makes you a lot burstier and reduces the cooldown by around half (when W is considered). The only way I could see W possibly being better is if you aren't getting any attack speed items.


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DDR16

Junior Member

08-16-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by hu4rollz View Post
I like Q>W because it makes you a lot bustier and reduces the cooldown by around half (when W is considered). The only way I could see W possibly being better is if you aren't getting any attack speed items.
have just found that the harassing nature of E works extremely well


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VejiTehDestroyer

Senior Member

08-16-2010

Definitely got my 'up' vote. These tips are awesome and i can use a few. I just want to know how viable of a jungler he is and a jungling setup/route.


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hu4rollz

Senior Member

08-16-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by DDR16 View Post
have just found that the harassing nature of E works extremely well
Definitely, I was responding to a post where the other guy agreed with me about getting E first and was only talking about the choice of which skill to get second (after both have a point in them).


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hu4rollz

Senior Member

08-16-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by VejiTehDestroyer View Post
Definitely got my 'up' vote. These tips are awesome and i can use a few. I just want to know how viable of a jungler he is and a jungling setup/route.
I haven't jungled much with him but he is quite capable in this role. He is definitely slower that than the "tier 1" junglers like shaco/ww/amumu but he can still be effective.

If you have the right setup you can get blue first, but you have to cut it really close. This is what I did when I jungled with him but I don't recommend it. I would try starting at the bottom two golem camp with a cloth armor and 5 hp pots and working your way up around golems > wraiths > wolves > blue. That's just a guess though, if anyone with plenty of jungle Xin experience wants to chime in I would appreciate it.

Phreak on his champion spotlight got a green elixer and some hp pots and went blue golem > wolves > lizard which allows you to start ganking with both buffs very early, so you could try that too.

The reason I don't jungle with him is because he's such a strong laner when leveling E.


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