Should Ryze's Ult Be Adjusted

Do not allow Ryze's ult to bounce off of himself 17 40.48%
Have Ryze's ult deal half damage to himself when it bounces off of him 7 16.67%
Do nothing, its fine the way it is 18 42.86%
Voters: 42. You may not vote on this poll

Adjusting Ryze's Ult

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yoshanity

Member

10-18-2009

Mercurius, I don't mean to belittle you but I have never seen you in any game and thus I can assume that you are not in high ELO play (when you start seeing names like Dan Dinh, Dyrus/I Play Jax, Classick, TreeEskimo, etc. in your games then you can safely assume you're somewhere near the top).

As far as KingofTown's creep observation goes, if you throw Ryze's ult at a hero within a bunch of creeps you'd be lucky to get more than 2 bounces to hit on your intended target (if you happen to get a kill you have to blame that on pure luck and you might as well go buy a lottery ticket then).

If you had 240 MR and somehow a Ryze solo'd you with his ult then he must have had a ridiculous amount of AP that I'm not even sure is possible in this game (maybe you just had 240 MR but no HP to back it up though I find that really unlikely). It is your fault for letting him get that farmed when he is so easily ganked. He's one damn squishy champion and if your team is not smart enough to focus him down early then that is a simple mistake that your team made. As with any other glass cannon type champion, Ryze cannot simultaneously do ridiculous damage while also not dying in less than 2 seconds of focus fire. The best any Ryze in a high-level game could ever hope is to make the fight a 4v4 not a 5v4 (in other words getting a kill usually means getting killed for Ryze). Ryze is overly cooldown dependent and he often times cannot even live to cast a second Rune Prison or Overload. Also Rune Prison does not stop spell-casting which is a big downfall.

Trust me, Ryze was my main when I first started playing this game and I found out the hard way how poorly his ability set scales into the higher tiers of play. I can still sometimes run off games where I get a ridiculous amount of kills with Ryze because he is one of those heroes who feeds off a good early start. Just ask Shirokuma as I went 33/7/10 a few days ago with Ryze, but I was only able to because the other team allowed me to feed off them early and they failed to focus me in team fights.

If you feel like playing a game, add me on friends I play on my account statikk typically.


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warmonkey

Senior Member

10-18-2009

ryze is kinda silly now tbh.

granted, the short distance his ult would bounce previously was annoying, but the huge distance it bounces now just makes it half worthless. it'll take off across half the map and bounce off a bunch of creep. it's so not-scary right now.. plus, 100+ MR and ryze just runs up, unloads him combo on you, and then stands there all dumb while you rip his face off


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Mercurius

Senior Member

10-18-2009

Again, you didn't read my post. I specifically described how Ryze's ult works and having creeps around does not lower the damage.


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KingOfTown

Member

10-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercurius View Post
Again, you didn't read my post. I specifically described how Ryze's ult works and having creeps around does not lower the damage.
You do know that it bounces randomly, right? So if are standing with a wave of creeps your chances of getting hit by it after the first bounce is 1/x where x is the number of creeps you are hanging out with. If its you and your 4 mates then it spreads the damage out, which mitigates the point of the spell. As long as you don't let Ryze bait you in to a situation where you are without nearby creeps then you should probably be fine.

Also (again) just stack some MR, or get a Banshees or cleanse. If he can't keep you there then you will only get hit once or maybe twice by his ult. Then you turn around and chew his face off.


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yoshanity

Member

10-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercurius View Post
Again, you didn't read my post. I specifically described how Ryze's ult works and having creeps around does not lower the damage.
Now you're just avoiding the point. If his ult doesn't kill you because it hurts the creeps instead, then that's good for you. Sure it's going to kill the creeps but plenty of things can destroy creeps. Then your point is moot. His ult is not as strong as you make it out to be.


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Bait

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Senior Member

10-18-2009

on ryze's defense, he probably has the lowest range of all ranged heroes. he also has **** for life. once people get banshee's veil or force of nature, ryze won't do jack. if you gank him, his ult will spread on multiple players and won't kill as a result. his movement speed isn't good either.if you have creeps, his ult will likely bounce on one of them and won't seem op as a result.


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BoxmanFTW

Senior Member

10-18-2009

A cheap counter is chalice of harmony

I found it to be a great addition to almost every hero utilizing mana and provides a decent MR early game versus ryze (and pretty much every other character that casts spells).

The more i use it the more I fall in love with it.


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Rezziver

Senior Member

10-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by albatroxx View Post
While playing against Ryze I have noticed a problem. Whenever he catches you alone/almost alone/while you are defending a turret until creeps arrive/etc. you die. Ryze uses his ult and because he has stacked AP you take several hundred damage 4 times (once for stun, 3 times for ult). All the while you are stunned. There is no way to avoid this happening.

No other ult in the entire game guarantees an instant kill. This is a good thing. An ult should be powerful, it should not give you an instant win.

With this in mind I propose two possible solutions:
  • Change Ryze's ult so that it cannot bounce off of him, forcing it to be used more skillfully and at optimum times.
  • Change Ryze's ult so that when it bouces off of him it deals 50% damage to Ryze
Either of these changes would prevent Ryze from being the ridiculous one stop hero solution that he currently is.
My friend and I discussed this issue about Ryze, and we came to the conclusion that everytime that Spell Flux bounces, it should weaken by a percentile every time, so for example, every time it bounce off an enemy hero or himself the damage it does is decreased by 20% or so


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AcronymEjr

Junior Member

10-18-2009

The other day I saw someone playing a Ryze, and there was a standoff between the 2 teams. Each side had 3-4 champs nearby, and so a Ryze goes and shoots off his ult. As the spell is flying off toward his target, the Ryze backs up so not to get ganked, and after the spell hit the target, it bounced BACK to Ryze, who was a good 600+ distance away. He was so far away from any enemy at that point that the ult simply ended. There were multiple other people near his target, and it just ignored them. I thought it was pretty funny.

Regardless, I haven't thought of Ryze as a threat in ages. During my first week he was pretty scary, but after that I never really worried about him. He's really not that strong, and in upper elo games you simply will very rarely see him.


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Evernight

Senior Member

10-19-2009

50% of the dmg to Ryze is a bit much .... if it were 30% minus his MR I think it would be alot better. Not to mention that the whole point of the spell is so he doesn't use it on himself! It's supposed to be a "skilled timing" ability. Currently it is a "oh look a guy! BLARG!" spell.


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