Magic resist vs Magic penetration need advice

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Feral Animosity

Senior Member

01-23-2012

P.S : Please no QQ or trolling, im new and I just want some advice and tips because I sometimes struggle with this problem and want some advice from the pros. <(' '<)

When someone stacks magic resist, seems impossible for any AP to do anything to them. Seems like we can't get enough magic pen to go over their magic resist.

Spirit visage 30
Guadrian angel 38
Abyssal scepter 57
Quicksilver 56
boots 25
force of nature 76
aegis 24
wits end 30
hexdrinker 30
chalice 30
cloak 48
mantle 24

Magic pen :

Abyssal scepter 20
Haunting guise 20
Shoes 20
Void staff 40%
Malady ( don't really count it as i wont stack basic attacks with Leblanc or annie )

Now you get a tank that stacks magic resist and your in a game with 3 AP, how is the tank suppose to die ? I know he wont buy all the resist gear i listed, but there's really a huge selection, and if he does really decide to get 6 pieces of magic resist.

Lets just say a Rammus who decides to get, guardian angel, aegis, force of nature and spirit visage, or even just a cloak for for extra resistance, which is gear some tanks would get quite often vs AP teams.

That's 192 magic resist vs 40% and 60 magic penetration if I have the magic pen items I listed. That brings it down to 16 magic resist. Now you can say well just get another Haunting guise, but thats 1485, and if anything the tank just gets a cloak for 740 and give him 48 magic resist.

16 doesn't sound like much, but I read somewhere that 10 magic resist was 9.1% reduced damage. That's still quite alot. I don't count magic pen runes and masteries, because there is magic resist runes and masteries too.

I just don't see how I can still have a good amount of ability power with enough magic resist to actually do some damage. Haunting guise is really only 25 AP when i could of gotten hourglass for 100 ap instead.

I played a game with 2 other AP characters and we tried to take a Garen down, who is more of an offtank, and he stacked magic resist and 3 casters and i had my ultimate with annie and could not get him down appros 30% before he killed us. Just seems so much easier and less costly to get magic resist vs magic pen.

I know you might say yea well let the AD kill him, but doesnt that mean that my character and the other AP will litterally have 0 chance vs this person, what if im in dominion and were protecting a flag vs a magic res tank with garrison, do i really just walk away cus we cant 2v1 him.

I don't have this problem often, I do pretty good with my casters, I tend to do relly well in kiting, saving my stun, juking. I'ts just in these rare occasions when some tank or semitank decides he's going to stack magic resist, I feel helpless and it seems that he will always get more magic resist faster than I can get magic pen because of the low cost.


Please give me your advice, thank you in advance.


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TheOneMillion

Senior Member

01-23-2012

If the tank is stacking MR, they arnt stacking armor or damage, which means that the AP is scary enough to force them to stack MR, and the ad carry will shred them. and 16 MR is nothing. 9.1% reduced damage isnt going to save somone from a 2000 damage nuke combo. Thats 200 reduced damage, and in 6 seconds you can do it again.

If somone is really stacking MR just to counter you, your best bet is to just get a void staff and then get the usual caster items, rabadons death cap ect. % magic pen and flat magic pen stack in a bad way so its better to stick with one. If they are over 100 MR, get a void staff. If they are under 100 jus stick with sorc boots and the 9 typical rune penetration. You can grab an abyssal if you need the MR also.


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Astral Yorae

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Senior Member

01-23-2012

I used to have a thumb rule for this:
-If target have less than 100 MR, I go with the flat magic pen setup:
Runes = 20 pen (rounded up)
Boots = 20 pen
Haunted = 20 pen
Abyssal = -20 MR

-If target have more than 100 MR, I go with void and get more AP.

The problem with this thumb rule is obvious. You can't predict, when choosing runes, if the enemies will have or not more than 100 MR. Also, using the Flat Pen Setup will use a lot of item slots for this purpose. Nowdays I prefer to stick with Void and I use the extra item and rune slots for something else. It fits better MY playstyle. The downside of this is that you have lower early game damage so, in my view, it will end up with the champion you are playing and your style. For example, if you are a Le Blank you will possible want the flat pen, because her early game is strong and you may get some kill with it. Now, if you plan getting a sustained damage mage (like Rumble), you could stick with the Void.
There is a line that after it's worth getting more AP than pen. You can have some small hints in the Graphs in the Calculator Topic (link in the end of this post). Even tought they were made for physical damage, the behavior will be similar. Also, try using the Skill Damage Calculator so you can make some tests on your own and find the best setup for yourself.

Also, having 3 casters in a team wouldn't be the best composition, in MY oppinion. But even in this case, tell your mates to focus all the damage dealers and suports and ignore the tank. With them dead, your AD guy can take the tank easier. It's all a question of teamwork in this example. Now, if ENTIRE team stacks loads of MR (more than 150), that means they sacrificed some damage output. As 3 of you are mages, get each a Will of Ancients (the aura bonus from an ally will stack with yours ONCE, that means lots of Spell Vamp) and now you have some more sustain. Grab a defense items according to your needs (Some I like are Abyssal, Lichbane or Zonia) and now they have High MR, but will have a HARD time killing you too. And you still have high AP (with Lichbane, that means you take towers easy).
Be dynamic, adapt to the match, and you will have way less problems.

I hope it helps. =)
Astral Yorae



Calculator Link:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=1337522


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SavageWolves

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Senior Member

01-23-2012

With a void staff and the mpen mastery, you have 50% magic pen. Adding another 29 from runes and the boots, you have a 120 MR champ down to base resist levels. (Also, Lich Bane deals Physical Damage, so with the right character you can do a lot with these procs.)


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Astral Yorae

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Senior Member

01-23-2012

Actually SavageWolves, Void and mastery won't make it 50%, but close to it.
The % Pens do not stacks additively.
That means they would act as the following formula:
MR x 0.6* x 0.9** = MR x 0.54 (so, would be actually 46% magic pen)
*= 100% -40% = 60% or 0.6
**= 100% -10% = 90% or 0.9