How to counter AD carries as a tank?

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OninomizuRaaxon

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Senior Member

01-22-2012

I mean, I know the Thornmail trick, but other than that... What can I do? Especially against Vayne and Kog'Maw.

I play tank Singed most of the time, and these two champions are the bane of me. And if they end up get a Madred's, even worse. They take me apart too quickly for me to be of any use to my team.

How do I counter these counters?

This is my usual Singed build

Rod of Ages
Ninja Tabi (the new stuff, with the 10% less damage)
Force of Nature
Frozen Heart
Rabadon's Deathcap
Situational, I hardly get to this stage of the game

Sometimes I do this:
Abyssal Scepter - if the opposing team is more AD heavy than AP, and/or my team has a high number of AP champions.
Thornmail - If they opposing them is more auto-attack champions, such as Yi, Trynd or ranged carries


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Carados

Senior Member

01-22-2012

A) Tanks don't exist. No one's job is to sit back and take damage, as you can't. If you stop thinking "i'm a tank" and realize what you're actual job is, you'll be doing much better.

B) Thornmail is ****. This is common knowledge.

C) Thornmail is ****. Just restated.

D) If you want a useful armor item, Frozen Heart is the gold standard. It actually causes them to deal less damage, and keeps your team alive.

E) Thornmail is a newbie trap of an item.


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OninomizuRaaxon

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Senior Member

01-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carados View Post
A) Tanks don't exist. No one's job is to sit back and take damage, as you can't. If you stop thinking "i'm a tank" and realize what you're actual job is, you'll be doing much better.

B) Thornmail is ****. This is common knowledge.

C) Thornmail is ****. Just restated.

D) If you want a useful armor item, Frozen Heart is the gold standard. It actually causes them to deal less damage, and keeps your team alive.

E) Thornmail is a newbie trap of an item.
A) I know this. But there are some champions who excel in taking more damage than, say, the actual damage dealers on the team.

B) Thornmail, in regards to the stats, is pretty crud. But the passive is fairly good when dealing with a 1 on 1 encounter, and can soften up the carries in a team fight.

D) I tend to go FH more often anyway, for the CDR and mana.

E) Yeah, it looks great on paper, but is **** in play.

That being said... I've gotten a double kill playing singed, 'cause a Yi and an Ashe were chasing me, the Thornmail was doing just as much damage as my poison and I ended up with the double kill while surviving.


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SynergyDreamer

Senior Member

01-22-2012

Randuin's?


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Carados

Senior Member

01-22-2012

The passive is **** because it deals almost no damage to anyone.

30% of someone's autoattack is already pretty lame. Then you add in their MR, at least 50 on any smart player and almost always more, especially on melee carries. Then Lifesteal... no damage.

And then you need to focus the person stacking survability...


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biomorph

Senior Member

01-22-2012

Carries eventually become scary heavy dps machines, that is why they are called carries. Your build is conceptually sound and if their carry is a problem you might want to farm FH before FoN since a early FH is very hard to deal with for carries. But again, eventually them carries will pack heavy damage and something like a last whisper, black cleaver, mbr (which is heavily negated by magic resist, not armor) and tear tanks and damagers alike apart because that is what they do. That is to say if your team fails to focus them down and/or they have good protection from their own team.
Vayne in particular has that nasty true damage passive which is just a nightmare for anyone, but she needs to get in close which results in high risk - high reward play.

Singed tends to fall off towards late game so you should not focus on your build but rather consider what tactic to bring, as I said, your build seems sound added some conditional priorities of items.


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SynergyDreamer

Senior Member

01-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carados View Post
The passive is **** because it deals almost no damage to anyone.

30% of someone's autoattack is already pretty lame. Then you add in their MR, at least 50 on any smart player and almost always more, especially on melee carries. Then Lifesteal... no damage.

And then you need to focus the person stacking survability...
Well, better less lifesteal than full....


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Cenerae

Senior Member

01-22-2012

The best counter to AD champions when you're on a tanky type is to attack them and generally get in their way as much as possible. Unless they're insanely stacked, they won't be able to simply ignore you, and you'll force them to attack you. This is good, because they're not hitting your squishy damage dealers. Frozen Heart and Randuins combined will take some of their bite away (thornmail is only good as a cheap source of armor, it's not generally worth buying), but other than that all you can do is try to be disruptive and hope they respond to you.


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Prometheius

Senior Member

01-22-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by OninomizuRaaxon View Post

Rod of Ages
Ninja Tabi (the new stuff, with the 10% less damage)
Force of Nature
Frozen Heart
Rabadon's Deathcap
Situational, I hardly get to this stage of the game
The **** is this ****?

Remove. Now. Ryali's. Get it. Randuin's. Get it.

Obvious counters are obvious. Make it so they can't kite or attack. Job done.


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ikillutwice

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Senior Member

01-22-2012

CHARGE! CHARGE CHARGE CHARGE! and CHARGE SOME MORE!(note have someone follow you when you CHARGE)


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