Having to beg your team to defend?

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Izaniki

Junior Member

01-19-2012

So, I just recently started playing Dominion quite a bit, and I realized that people don't seem to understand the concepts behind scoring. I was just in a game that we were winning by about 100+ points throughout, then when we get the other team sub-100 points, we end up getting torn up and brought down to like 40-20 for the other team.

Throughout this whole time, we could have easily held three points and won, but people kept running to take the points near the other team, leading to us losing 2/3 of the points we had (I was defending windmill). I was practically begging my team to just stay at our three points (once we got them back) and defend for the 30 seconds it would have taken to win, but they wouldn't listen. I didn't want to leave windmill and help them with taking other points, but I felt bad when they were getting killed 1v2.

We ended up winning like 25-0, but it was only because 3 of their team rushed windmill and we beat them in a team fight, so everyone was free to cap all they wanted.

Was I right in holding windmill the whole time vs. going to help them in their 1v2s, considering every time I left, the enemy came? Is there anything you can do (aside from queue with a group) to fix problems like this?

tl;dr: People don't defend even when begged. Anything you can do to make them listen?


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CaptainSoda

Senior Member

01-19-2012

I'll be honest here. I know you'll hate me for saying this, but myself, and most people, really don't care about defending in Dominion. In fact, if you ever see me even remotely near a point it's because the enemy is there and that's just one kill to add to my counter. I honestly don't play Dominion to seriously and most of the time just try and see how many kills I can get and how many items I can get before the game ends.

I know you'll hate me for this, but at least I'm honest


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Ascleph

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Senior Member

01-19-2012

Did someone come while you were defending windmill and your team getting slaughtered? would your presence in the team fight for their points end up in your team winning it?
Dying trying to take the enemy's "home points" can cost you the game, but defending just 3 points w/o moving only gives the enemy an oportunity for a comeback. The ideal course of action is to STILL be a threat to their mid or bottom but to NOT die while sieging it.
Dying while trying to take their mid/bottom when you are winning is the worst thing you can do.


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FDru

Senior Member

01-19-2012

When you're defending you lose map control, which is the most important thing in Dominion. For the most part you should be mobile, trying to control the jungle, and keeping pressure on the enemy points you do not control. Sitting around just trying to defend three points doesn't work for long because in that situation the other team has the offensive advantage.


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crujuco

Senior Member

01-19-2012

I agree with defending the three points but you dont need to be physically standing on a point. A good place to defend is the speedshrine central to your 3 points. Each speedshrine has bush around 3 parts of it. You can either burst down a lone back cappers or rush back to a tower if there are to many to take by yourself.

I find the worst thing you can do (I am less guilty of this now), is trying to prevent a cap by yourself against multiple enemies (ussally they are half health). If you dont manage to kill them they cap anyway. sometimes its better to let them cap and wait for reinforcements.

Another thing I have found especially bot, if you get ganked and you know you're going to die, dont run toward your point. it is better to try to get them to chase you back towards their point while pinging the point that will need defence.

A few times I ran back to my turret and be so low health that they can take the couple of turret hits to finish me and then instantly cap. If i ran to their point I wouldve bought my team and myself some more time to defend the point. IE if it takes them 8 seconds to run to your point after they kill you. That is 8 seconds less on your death counter.


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Sir Headless VII

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Senior Member

01-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by FDru View Post
When you're defending you lose map control, which is the most important thing in Dominion. For the most part you should be mobile, trying to control the jungle, and keeping pressure on the enemy points you do not control. Sitting around just trying to defend three points doesn't work for long because in that situation the other team has the offensive advantage.
This is what I was going to say but less eloquently. If you are passively sitting on 3 points it slowly becomes impossible to defend them as you have no way of preventing them from grouping up onto whatever point you have least defended.


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TakinTheHeat

Senior Member

01-19-2012

The only advice I can give is to raise your elo. Where you are right now is pretty low and its not OK, but it is understandable that people there aren't playing as seriously as higher up. It's really not that hard to win pretty much all your games when you are in the lower elos. Remember, the enemy team has the same problem yours does and if it doesn't its just bad luck, it will average out. Play blind and pick overpowered champs, as well. Vlad can be good bot but hes by no means an excellent pick for every game.

This gives a general idea of what to go for..

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=1697505

I looked at your match history and you can see for yourself what happens when you play someone like rammus. You won, in first place, with more points than any of your other dom games that I can see.


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ManPandas

Member

01-19-2012

Like others have said, defending is generally a futile endeavor. Mainly because its easy for the other team to calculate where they can attack and win. I've played close to 500 dominion games, and before that I played an embarrassingly uncountable number of battlegrounds in wow with basin being my far-and-away favorite. You just need to learn the ebb and flow of the game. In most cases, heavy pressure in all directions will be the deciding factor in the game. Even 1 person suiciding a tower is fine, if it stalls 3+ enemies in that area at a critical point in the game.

The only players who should spend time defending a point are those who can take a 3-on-1 under a turret and win (or maybe end a 2v1 with over 50% HP). That's a really tall order, but some champs/players can pull it off. But for the most part, you want to be aggressive in Dominion. If your team can't win team fights try and stay spread out and apply pressure to all 3 bases simultaneously. If your team can't win duels, then clump up and sweep from point to point - and gank the jungle all day long. If you can't win fights, defense or offense won't matter - you're being outplayed.


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Huntsvoski

Senior Member

01-20-2012

People are way to aggressive on dominion, they win one big battle and assume every fight is going to be easy so they go looking for trouble. It's annoying when your team dies in horribly outmached fights in locations they should not be, all you can really do is point out they overextended and not to do it again.

In the mean time you should stick w/ your team but just get out if they commit to a battle which cannot be won. At least with you there they will get a few ganks and maybe win a few fights, things go much better.


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Red Smurf27

Member

01-20-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by crujuco View Post
I agree with defending the three points but you dont need to be physically standing on a point. A good place to defend is the speedshrine central to your 3 points. Each speedshrine has bush around 3 parts of it. You can either burst down a lone back cappers or rush back to a tower if there are to many to take by yourself.

I find the worst thing you can do (I am less guilty of this now), is trying to prevent a cap by yourself against multiple enemies (ussally they are half health). If you dont manage to kill them they cap anyway. sometimes its better to let them cap and wait for reinforcements.

Another thing I have found especially bot, if you get ganked and you know you're going to die, dont run toward your point. it is better to try to get them to chase you back towards their point while pinging the point that will need defence.

A few times I ran back to my turret and be so low health that they can take the couple of turret hits to finish me and then instantly cap. If i ran to their point I wouldve bought my team and myself some more time to defend the point. IE if it takes them 8 seconds to run to your point after they kill you. That is 8 seconds less on your death counter.
Best post I've read today. This is such an easy thing to do that I don't understand why it isn't done more often. There are significant advantages to having them chase you back to their side of the map that I wonder why I don't see this strategy more often. Running is a little bit different of a skill on Dominion because it can help give your teammates time to defend if you aren't running straight to your point.

Another thing that bothers me is when people are almost guaranteed to die and they continue to run (back to their **** point). At the very least if you know you are going to die run to their point, but I wish people would at least try to put some damage on the enemy team sometimes. You are going to die but the half health that you take somebody to before dying could help your team recapture the point or defend the point much more easily.

TL DR If you are going to die and you know it, run to their point or fight. Running to your point is a bad idea.