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Personal Scores--A brief argument that they mean something

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FDru

Senior Member

12-11-2011

I'd rather sit in jungle getting zero points if it means I can reinforce top or bot if needed, and prevent ninja attempts on our mid.

Also, the idea that kills off of nodes are somehow less valuable is hilarious. What is more valuable... killing Eve at the speed shrine before she accomplishes anything, or killing her after she's channeled your mid turret to 50% health? Nevermind that it's a lot easier to get kills when you catch the enemy off guard as they move across the map.

The team that does better tends to get more points because of kills (especially kill streaks, which rack up mega points) but it's all incidental. The bottom line is that the score system does not account for smart plays at all, and is therefore stupid.


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Kiddalee

Senior Member

12-11-2011

Quote:
xGvPx:
Eh, to me, KDA = only personal score that matters. My goal is always K>D and K+A>Dx2 if I'm tanking. It is funny how new personal score works though, sometimes you can be like 0/6 or 1/6 or something and get #1 somehow.


So you can rely on your team to take care of the points while you brawl every single game?


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Phourc

Senior Member

12-11-2011

Quote:
FDru:
Also, the idea that kills off of nodes are somehow less valuable is hilarious. What is more valuable... killing Eve at the speed shrine before she accomplishes anything, or killing her after she's channeled your mid turret to 50% health? Nevermind that it's a lot easier to get kills when you catch the enemy off guard as they move across the map.


Yes and no: It's valuable to gank the enemy in the jungle, it's valuable to catch the backdoor bs eve before they get to do anything, but for the average solo queue-er fighting in the jungle is a bad habit, they're much more likely to be ganked than to gank.

I die a little every time I watch someone chase an eve away from an undefended neutral point instead of claiming it. Protip: if you start your channel, they either have to let you have it, or return and let you fight them.

A good team with 3 points, or needing a third point, should be fighting on the points to 1) avoid backcaps 2) fight with the assistance of tower damage and 3) avoid ganks via the tower sight/reveal radius.

A GREAT team has more options available, but they also should be a bit beyond point-collecting or Epeen-comparing xP


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Cryswar

Senior Member

12-11-2011

score is nice, but the only real measure is whether or not you won

I've gone #1 ez as blitz, and then gone 5th in games where I was pretty blatantly the backbone of the team

I honestly don't even pay attention anymore when it doesn't make sense; more kills less deaths 2-3x the assists more caps/neutralizes than someone and still come in with less points than them? So long as you win, it's all good.


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Rainor

Senior Member

12-11-2011

Quote:
Mindllapse:
does smart plays and teamwork lead to higher personal scores? yes. most of the time.

then do higher personal scores indicate smart plays and good teamwork? yes. most of the time.

this is merely a very strong correlation, not causation.
that mean's most of the time having high scores is a good indicator for your ability to play as a team and play smart.


seriously people. the score system is fairly accurate in most instances. It's just some of those games where you get low score and are doing well while someone is terrible and has high score makes you all mad and riled up and focused on that particular isolated occurrence and you become biased towards the results and rage on forums about score


As the person prior to you stated, there are plenty of scenarios/achievements which are not logged by the point system currently.

For example, interrupting 3 people at a node by yourself and holding up the opposing team from capping or going anywhere for a good 20 seconds or so.

And seeing terrible people who do poorly in team work yet have a high score due to capping/neutralizing is not uncommon in Dominion. If you don't think it's possible, watch a Shaco or Eve or some other stealther sit at a node and just chain neutralize without doing anything else in a game.

Since you will be steamrolled in the ensuing 3v4 battles more likely than not, you won't gain many points and will thus be lower than the 'loner' just neutralize capping due to how the points system works.

Imo, remove the point system or at least hide it until the end of the game.


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KrYoS

Senior Member

12-11-2011

Personal score doesn't always matter that much, but I look for people who have consistent 1st, 2nd, 3rd place wins to add as friends. This usually means they are consistently good and have a strong grasp of the Dominion game mode. Now I've seen some good bot laners and other players I've added as friends simply based on what I've observed in-game. I can usually spot the trolls really fast and have seen some players who had a great score, I go in and look at their history, and it's filled with troll games and/or leaves.


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Speusippus

Senior Member

12-11-2011

Quote:
Rainor:
As the person prior to you stated, there are plenty of scenarios/achievements which are not logged by the point system currently.

For example, interrupting 3 people at a node by yourself and holding up the opposing team from capping or going anywhere for a good 20 seconds or so.

And seeing terrible people who do poorly in team work yet have a high score due to capping/neutralizing is not uncommon in Dominion. If you don't think it's possible, watch a Shaco or Eve or some other stealther sit at a node and just chain neutralize without doing anything else in a game.

Since you will be steamrolled in the ensuing 3v4 battles more likely than not, you won't gain many points and will thus be lower than the 'loner' just neutralize capping due to how the points system works.

Imo, remove the point system or at least hide it until the end of the game.


Hrm.

But if that shaco has been neutralizing a point the entire game, didn't they contribute quite a bit? If you've been losing in 3v4s the entire game, didn't you contribute quite little?


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Airecaire

Junior Member

12-11-2011

People tend to argue that Bot lane contributes the most, yet is not reflective in score. I have found that good bot lane's tend to score in top 3, not 1 or 2 per se, but usually hold down the 3rd spot consistently. Bot lane is not meant to farm at the mid point over and over, but push lane, and at least get neutralizes (which would give points), and caps if possible. Bot lanes are also not meant to hold enemy bottom. It is often better to cap and fall back and not die once you'd attracted 2+ defenders since it relieves pressure top. If a bot laner is consistently doing that, they will have a much better score, and be helping out their team properly.


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Cauldrath

Senior Member

12-11-2011

A team's total score will correlate with victory because many of the same things directly affect both: kills and point captures.

The problem is that score doesn't necessarily go to the one who contributed most to obtain it. If we have two people capping a point and I notice incoming enemies and intercept them so my teammate can finish channeling, and die in a 2v1 while leaving them both very low on health so my teammate can finish them off, who gets tons of points while the other gets almost none? Who contributed more to those points being obtained?


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FDru

Senior Member

12-11-2011

Quote:
Airecaire:
People tend to argue that Bot lane contributes the most, yet is not reflective in score. I have found that good bot lane's tend to score in top 3, not 1 or 2 per se, but usually hold down the 3rd spot consistently. Bot lane is not meant to farm at the mid point over and over, but push lane, and at least get neutralizes (which would give points), and caps if possible. Bot lanes are also not meant to hold enemy bottom. It is often better to cap and fall back and not die once you'd attracted 2+ defenders since it relieves pressure top. If a bot laner is consistently doing that, they will have a much better score, and be helping out their team properly.


You can hope to win the bot lane, but fact is you are going to end up in a stalemate most of the time (unless you're spamming a broken bot like Yorick in blind pick or something). Since a stalemate equals last place for both bot laners, guaranteed, does it mean they failed?

The best part is that if they do manage to outpush eachother and trade turrets, they will get their score inflated despite neither outplaying the other. It's just free points.