Ryze, Seriously

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Benedict Arnold

Member

09-30-2009

I've gotten beyond godlike in each game I've played with Ryze. Compared to the other casters, Ryze is a breeze. You can say flash/cleanse/magic resist counters him, but it's just not true at all. Ryze can stack tons of AP on himself, and doesn't even need spells to kill. I consistently lead my team in kills, creep kills, and tower kills.

There's just no comparison, Ryze has the best combos and abilities in the game. I will keep playing Ryze until he is nerfed, so I don't really care if the usual people cry out "RYZE IS JUST FINE", because I'm enjoying him too.


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Lawlerkats

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Senior Member

09-30-2009

All I can say is when played by someone who knows what he's doing, Ryze friggen hurts. All the time.


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Benedict Arnold

Member

09-30-2009

I just went another 2 games with beyond godlike. I had more than half of all my team's kills.

There's just no reason to NOT pick Ryze, unless you are bored with him. No other champion can come close to his abilities.


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Grotsnik

Senior Member

09-30-2009

He does a lot of damage and doesn't need a Lich Bane. Sounds like a strong hero. Consider he only has a single target stun and a very iffy ultimate, though. When you compare this to Veigar's late game damage or Annie's early game damage it seems pretty in line with each other. Ryze gets a free Lich bane but both the other damage casters have AOE stun abilities.

If you want to make any real point, you're going to have to crunch some numbers.


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Nayuki

Senior Member

09-30-2009

And then, friends, an experienced Ryze runs into an experienced Veigar.

Veigar laughs.

Ryze runs into Annie...Well, we all know Annie just is unfortunately a bit out of touch. She's very balanced, but she's dated and hard to compare with other casters currently with her kind of gimmick centered build. I'd give Ryze this one...unless Annie was in all out gimmick mode and had stacked stuns ready

Ryze runs into Cryo...lulz, oh poor Ryze, seriously, how can you even do a thing to her? Best case you kill her into egg mode and have spent all your abilities and ult to do it - she repops and you either had to run or even if you can do some new damage she can get away. Plus is she's a good Cryo she can Double-Damage 'E' and make the no-hp, no-mr, all-ap Ryze cry.

Janna/Morgana/Soraka are also what I'd classify as 'pure mages'...Janna really depends - if she keeps you far enough to use her gust, lulz, but an experienced Ryze versus Janna...ya, Janna is probably severely toast. Morgana, what are you gonna do? Any good Morgana is tanky as all hell and you can't rune prison her unless you burn one of your core abilities to blow off black shield. Morgana has no reason to EVER not rape Ryze face if done by two comparable players. Soraka...sucks, Ryze wins - just like EVERYONE else does on Soraka usually

Fiddlesticks...rofl, you're kidding, right? Pro Fiddle is going to flash out with crowstorm and either silence+fear+lifedrain or just fear+lifedrain and nice you break fear and rune prison toss the silence to prevent ult for that desperatly needed second to end you. If you see him first you can runeprison and probably hurt him really good - maybe win if you get the ult off - but a pro fiddle shouldn't let you close enough to bounce that ult before slapping a fear on you and dancing merrily.

And Karthas...oh Karthas...I'll give this one to Ryze, because while Karthas is pretty awesome I think a pro Ryze would be able to surpass the excellent harass ability of Karthas and land the nuke of doom. This fight could go either way probably, but I lean in favor of the pro Ryze.

Oh, wait, Zilean! I don't think Ryze has a chance here - Rune Prison won't stop the ultimate so the moment you start bouncing your ult he puts his on and slaps a time bomb on Ryze. He dies, you explode for a big chunk. He revives, if you're still there you get double bombed (probably dead) and have no ult to beat him back. Zilean is a severe horror for any burst DPSer, Ryze included.

So, compared Ryze to the other 9 'pure' casters I see...

5 of them I figure beat Ryze, 4 lose.

...That seems pretty balanced somehow...


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Benedict Arnold

Member

09-30-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grotsnik View Post
He does a lot of damage and doesn't need a Lich Bane. Sounds like a strong hero. Consider he only has a single target stun and a very iffy ultimate, though. When you compare this to Veigar's late game damage or Annie's early game damage it seems pretty in line with each other. Ryze gets a free Lich bane but both the other damage casters have AOE stun abilities.

If you want to make any real point, you're going to have to crunch some numbers.
Well since you didn't crunch any numbers either, your reply makes no real point.

I'll leave the number crunching to Riot or anyone else motivated enough to do so. Like I said, I don't really care if Ryze gets nerfed or not, as long as I get to play him, it's all good. All I'm saying is that regardless of how you want to crunch the numbers, I can easily get beyond godlike in any normal game. I have played Veigar, and I have played Annie. Sure, you can crunch the numbers to show that they are better than Ryze purely from a numbers standpoint, but practically, it's much, much easier to attain success with Ryze than either of those 2 heroes.

Yes, Veiger POTENTIALLY has an AOE stun, if Veiger is good at aiming it and the enemies cross the borders of the stun. It's actually pretty easy to avoid. I have owned Veigar countless times while inside his ring of stun by not crossing any of the borders. In addition, since the enemy needs to cross the border to actually get stunned, many times they are not where you need them to be, either too close or too far, throwing off your timing. Annie does have an AOE stun but it takes 5 spells to charge up, not exactly the most usefull AOE stun out there. You can't use it in a pinch, and saving up a stun means you have to forego using other spells in the meantime.

Now compare that to Ryze's stun which requires no aiming, totally disables your target instantly for 3 seconds along with damage over time. It's got a short cooldown, and can be used anytime, anywhere. No other single target stun comes close to it's power. If people cleanse it or flash away, that's fine. I can use it again in about 10 seconds, so what are they going to do? Like I said, there's simply no comparison.


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Nayuki

Senior Member

09-30-2009

Ryze has no stun. He has rune prison, which allows casting - a stun is FAR different from what Ryze has...

IE: He has a root.


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Benedict Arnold

Member

09-30-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nayuki View Post
And then, friends, an experienced Ryze runs into an experienced Veigar.

Veigar laughs.

Ryze runs into Annie...Well, we all know Annie just is unfortunately a bit out of touch. She's very balanced, but she's dated and hard to compare with other casters currently with her kind of gimmick centered build. I'd give Ryze this one...unless Annie was in all out gimmick mode and had stacked stuns ready

Ryze runs into Cryo...lulz, oh poor Ryze, seriously, how can you even do a thing to her? Best case you kill her into egg mode and have spent all your abilities and ult to do it - she repops and you either had to run or even if you can do some new damage she can get away. Plus is she's a good Cryo she can Double-Damage 'E' and make the no-hp, no-mr, all-ap Ryze cry.

Janna/Morgana/Soraka are also what I'd classify as 'pure mages'...Janna really depends - if she keeps you far enough to use her gust, lulz, but an experienced Ryze versus Janna...ya, Janna is probably severely toast. Morgana, what are you gonna do? Any good Morgana is tanky as all hell and you can't rune prison her unless you burn one of your core abilities to blow off black shield. Morgana has no reason to EVER not rape Ryze face if done by two comparable players. Soraka...sucks, Ryze wins - just like EVERYONE else does on Soraka usually

Fiddlesticks...rofl, you're kidding, right? Pro Fiddle is going to flash out with crowstorm and either silence+fear+lifedrain or just fear+lifedrain and nice you break fear and rune prison toss the silence to prevent ult for that desperatly needed second to end you. If you see him first you can runeprison and probably hurt him really good - maybe win if you get the ult off - but a pro fiddle shouldn't let you close enough to bounce that ult before slapping a fear on you and dancing merrily.

And Karthas...oh Karthas...I'll give this one to Ryze, because while Karthas is pretty awesome I think a pro Ryze would be able to surpass the excellent harass ability of Karthas and land the nuke of doom. This fight could go either way probably, but I lean in favor of the pro Ryze.

Oh, wait, Zilean! I don't think Ryze has a chance here - Rune Prison won't stop the ultimate so the moment you start bouncing your ult he puts his on and slaps a time bomb on Ryze. He dies, you explode for a big chunk. He revives, if you're still there you get double bombed (probably dead) and have no ult to beat him back. Zilean is a severe horror for any burst DPSer, Ryze included.

So, compared Ryze to the other 9 'pure' casters I see...

5 of them I figure beat Ryze, 4 lose.

...That seems pretty balanced somehow...

Purely theoretical, fabricated situations. I'm not here to talk about whatever stories you can make up. You're assuming 1v1, with comparable skills and levels and gear. In each of your stories, you are assuming perfect execution. What if Morgana misses the stun? What if Fiddlesticks misses a silence? What if Ryze has a teammate with him? In each of your stories I can make up something where Ryze comes out on top. Your stories have added nothing to this discussion.

I'm not going to deny that any of the above situations is impossible, though. And I'm sure that a pro with prefect execution can destroy an average Ryze. But look at me. I'm not a pro player. I admit that. Yet I have found Ryze to have the easiest, most damaging combos of any caster. By the time Veiger sets his stun, casts his delayed nuke, or whatever else, I can spam my 3 spell combo in one second and while you're still stunned hit you with my super charged regular attack.

EASE-WISE, Ryze has no equal.


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Nayuki

Senior Member

09-30-2009

...So you want an easy hero? Why does that matter, ease of pick up means nothing in top tier gaming. If you want to pub stomp any hero will work. Sure, Ryze is easier, but they're all pretty easy.

Once it becomes a game of skill on the other hand in real premade matchups and such an easy character is BAD though because you hit the roof of what skill can do earlier than a harder character.

Ryze is labled the 'pub stomper' for a reason - he decimates, absolutely decimates, people who don't know the game at a high level yet. His ease of use is crippling later on though - which I don't think is worth it. I'd rather know the character I am good with cna be good all game rather than useful for crushing the dreams of new players only.

Edit: And my situations all assume 1v1 with completely similar ability players. What if Morgana misses her snare? That doesn't hurt her at all, you still can't kill her due to her being tanky beefy build and being immune to Rune Prison unless you blow a nuke. Fiddlesticks can't miss silence, it's direct targetted, only way he 'misses' is if he panics and then he doesn't qualify to be an even level player as the Ryze he is fighting against. If Ryze has a team mate the entire situation is moot because then it becomes a matter of team play, which is an entirely different conversation. Your simply being blind.

Edit 2: Ryze does NOT have a stun. Rune Prison does not stun. All spells can be cast while in Rune Prison. Learn the terminology, it is a ROOT...

Edit 3: Your Rune Prison, btw, has less range than Veigar's Dark Matter and Event Horizon. If the Veigar is playing comparably to the Ryze he will cast Event Horizon with the Ryze in center, Ryze will then be able to barely get in range to Rune Prison without being stunned most likely - but puts Veigar outside of other nuke range. Veigar will use Dark Matter which can't be avoided inside Event Horizon and hits HARD. Then it comes down to who can hit R first - which is iffy, since Veigar's 'R' is one big burst while Ryze bounces - but Veigar is squishy and would only take a couple bounces. It's a good match, but I favor Veigar.


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Benedict Arnold

Member

09-30-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nayuki View Post
...So you want an easy hero? Why does that matter, ease of pick up means nothing in top tier gaming. If you want to pub stomp any hero will work. Sure, Ryze is easier, but they're all pretty easy.

Once it becomes a game of skill on the other hand in real premade matchups and such an easy character is BAD though because you hit the roof of what skill can do earlier than a harder character.

Ryze is labled the 'pub stomper' for a reason - he decimates, absolutely decimates, people who don't know the game at a high level yet. His ease of use is crippling later on though - which I don't think is worth it. I'd rather know the character I am good with cna be good all game rather than useful for crushing the dreams of new players only.
Please, so you're saying that only pro teams use hard-to-use champions? If you're saying that Ryze is not useful in the hands of experienced players, I'd ask you to prove that. Stop with the elitist remarks, I can prove anything by saying that "real premade matchups" can do xxxxx.