Ali Build Help

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AlexDnD

Member

11-04-2011

So I like to play Ali support bot. Here is what I'm currently doing -

Level up - Q E W E E R

This helps me sustain the AD carry usually bot.

I normally start with Regrow + Mana Potion. When I have enough I go back for a philo stone and grab a ward or two. Eventually I'll also get boots.

So some people are upset that I don't get boots of mobility but my CDs are ridiculously long. If I don't get some CD I use my spells once in a team fight and that is it. Am I doing this wrong? Should I stick with CD boots or go for the mobility ones?

Also after that I'm never sure what to go. Sometimes I'll get Heart of Gold. Sometimes I'll get Glacial shroud / Negatron cloak to help tank some. Any suggestions? I know there are guides out there but a lot of them seem to have outdated info.


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iP1ayJarvan

Senior Member

11-04-2011

don't take too many E. ali should be harassing and zoning by 'threat factor' being in the bushes. the enemy won't dare to come too far out from fear of being knocked up and punted for a sizable sum of damage PROVIDED Q AND W ARE LEVELED EARLY. 1 rank in E is all you need, if your carry got careless and nuked to 1/4 hp, slowly regen him with a level 1 E while HE PLAYS CAREFULLY

do QEWQQR then R>Q>W>E

its not like the regen is going to totally rescue him if he gets caught out if leveled 1 or 2 ranks higher.

as for core items, your core should be philo, hog, aegis and swiftness. ms runes and utility tree will give you a total ms of 423, easily catching up with most non-PD champs to knock them up.

for other items, it depends on the enemy team but it'll mostly be defensive.


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AlexDnD

Member

11-04-2011

Hmmm I usually get defensive masteries so I can tank later on with my ult. Your saying go utility? And I also use HP quints (well only one's i have lol) but between that and no defensive masteries I'll be a little squishy.


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SynergyDreamer

Senior Member

11-04-2011

Not to be lazy but I don't know if I could explain better than my previous posts, so here:

(I was on my friend's account, lol)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Klocke View Post
I would disagree for him being "easy", but he's not difficult either.
For runes I just use my caster rune page. CDR Glyphs, MPen Marks, MP/5 Seals. I also have 2 MS Quints and an AP Quint.
Masteries going 9-0-21. Speccing for Ghost and Flash with all of the CDR.

I dislike building pure AP Alistar because his ult is nice but without beef it doesn't do much. So I prefer some sustainability. I usually start out with a Mana Manipulator, and then rush Merc Treads and Shurelia's. Why not keep the Philo stone? I prefer the MS boost for more champion kills and more won team fights (with less devastating, lost team fights) over the wimpy gold/5. Eventually I'll get the Soul Shroud. Your CDR should be capped, or atleast near capped if you use tier 1 CDR Glyphs. After that it gets situational (and I usually win games before anything else).
Good selects afterward include: Rylai's, Abyssal, Rod of Ages, Lichbane (last of all of them), Aegis, Force of Nature, Frozen Heart, Banshee's Veil, and Randuin's. If you're really feeling up to it, go for a Mejai's early.

As far as actually using Alistar...
I usually start with Headbutt, Heal, Pulverize. Less often Pulverize first instead of Headbutt.
I usually go Headbutt to harass, or if they get in a real dumb position push them into an even dumber position. If the opposition is of a melee pair that can easily approach your partner, then Pulverize to ward them both off.
A simple combo I use is Headbutt-Pulverize, as of opposed to vice-versa. This would only work if you could knock them to a thick wall so as a result, you have them pinned down and you're next to them to Pulverize. But it's a really nice way to approach the enemies without using your ghost and flash.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SynergyDreamer View Post
I guess the Headbutt-thenPulverizebeforetheyfly trick works too, but you get A LOT more disable out of headbutting them against a wall then pulverizing before that stun wears off.

Other advice:
If there is an easy kill, be very careful not to headbutt it away from your team, that's just frustrating. Or if it's a champion that will literally kill your team, try not to headbutt them into the center of your team (eg: Galio). To stop a channel though, such as Galio's ult, headbutt will disrupt. If a Galio flashes into your team and ults, then use your ult to counter that and Pulverize him to save your team. :]

Flash-Pulverize makes for a mean initiation in a large team. Using a Shurelia's before that means your team can focus the right targets just a little faster too. It's CD is short though, so make sure to activate it in order to run away or run to an already occuring team fight even faster.

Make sure to time your heals with the death of enemy minions, as well as healing away from your minions to not push (during laning phase. If pushing then heal everything).

Alternatively instead of Ghost-Flash, Teleport-Flash allows you to push even better (teleport onto a minion, saves a few turret hits or minions) and get to the field better. It also allows for some really mean counter-ganks. If your river is warded, or preferably the brush closest to your ally's tower, teleport onto that ward and just wreck those over-extenders.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SynergyDreamer View Post
Sorry, I got lost in that scramble-damble paragraph to be honest, but I read that request for items, masteries, and runes.

Since you're only level 17, don't spend on runes yet. Maybe Tier 1's just to experiment around. But buy enough champions that you are comfortable and good with then start spending runes. To those of you who say Tier 1's are trash, okay, they're only half as effective as Tier 3's but at a tenth of the price. Better those than nothing'eh?

Most universal runes include:
Armor Penetration, Magic Penetration.
Flat Armor, Scaling Mana Regeneration, Dodge (most expensive)
Magic Resist (scaling or flat, doesn't matter too much), CDR Glyphs (most expensive)
Flat HP Quints.

Recently I've been running 3-6-21 on my Alistar. Focusing on Ghost and Flash. Getting the AP boost from the Offensive Tree and the Armor and Magic Resist from the Defensive Tree.
For Runes, I've really changed mine up. These were not designed for Alistar but still work, I've switched my caster page to having MPen Marks, Scaling Mana Regeneration for Seals and Quints, with CDR Glyphs. It does work, but spells must be spaced out and when at low mana used sparingly.

What I used to do was use Teleport-Flash instead. Counter-ganking from across the map has a nice degree of success, especially with those two powerful CC's. If you're going in for a kill or two, make sure to teleport on a minion closest to the opposition's tower. If you're going in to save your allies, then teleport to your own tower to ward them off.

Some would say 9-0-21 for Alistar, focusing on cooldown reduction. Also for their runes most likely going for Flat HP Quints. I'd also recommend MS Runes.

Your current set up is good. And I'm not going to throw an AP item build but here's what I usually build:
I tend to focus around supporting and tanking.
Depending on my team, I usually start with a Mana Manipulator. Sometimes just a Regrowth or Doran's Ring if my allies are not mana-based.
I usually end up with at least (with most games, at most): Mercury Treads, Shurelia's, and Soul Shroud.

Boots of Mobility are nice, but when team fights start going'bout it is much better to have that CC reduction for when you're out of your ultimate.

Item builds are highly dependent on enemy and allied team composition.
Against Physical: Frozen Heart (if you get only Shurelia's and Soul Shroud, not both), Thornmail, Randuin's Omen.
Against Magical: Abyssal Scepter, Banshee's Veil, Force of Nature.
Other items to consider: Aegis of the Legion.

I wish I could've said more on the item builds, but my games as Alistar are usually short. Not to sound audacious but for about 80% of my games as Alistar, my team and I would win by the 20 minute mark. For the other 18%, just bad games that end up with a 20 minute loss.
But also, I like Merc Treads on Alistar because his ultimate becomes a tanky Cleanse (negates a disable and CC reduction). :]


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AlexDnD

Member

11-04-2011

Interesting stuff. It sounds though that this Ali is more of a gank/tank than a babysit carry in the bot lane. Like not taking CV would get me screamed at...


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SynergyDreamer

Senior Member

11-04-2011

He could do both. I usually begin as a carry's babysitter, but after a while I start ganking because it is soooo rewarding. Just let's me build without relying on gp/10. Especially as Alistar with that tank ult, tower diving is so much easier with that. I've never tried him with CV, but I wouldn't discourage it at all.

At previous posts:
Ali and Leona really really like reduced cooldowns to do the do. Sure the heal is nice, but being able to disrupt the team more (leveling Q and W) is probably more rewarding in fast-paced combat. I THINK that's why I downvoted the other post.

Going the Offensive-Utility Masteries really allows Alistar to do more of the disruption and tank-via ult. I 'spose you'll feel squishy without those Defensive specs, but the more constant and intimidating harass and sustain should do more than make up for what you've lost in the defensive masteries.

edit: omg omg i'm so dumb i lied q-w lol sorry for that downvote and stuff so so so so sorry


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Wisewind

Senior Member

11-04-2011

I would rather go Q at rank 3, seriously the AoE heal at rank 3 gives your ally 30 more hp which is not worth it imo. If you must compromise than just take rank 2, but maxing Q as early as possible is overall the better choice since it CD lowers. Also Rank 3 pulverize will help you protect tower in case you are left alone in lane early game as it can clear out a creep wave with trample passive.

Also try fairy charm, 4 pots, and 2 wards as your starting items