Let's really compare armor penetrate to critical chance

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wildfire393

Senior Member

06-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by sanjiluv View Post
Im not exactly sure how this works in LOL. But in dota and HoN you can actually go below 0 armor giving bonus damage

for example if you dropped to -5 armor you'd take a bonus 10% damage. (past having 0% reduction on the normal attack. so normal attack +10% of that attack.)

clarify anyone?
This is true in LoL, but not with Armor Penetration, only with Armor Reduction. If you reduce a target's armor to the negatives, they take extra damage equal to the percentage that that much positive armor would reduce your damage by.

So for example, 50 armor reduces damage by 33%, so -50 armor increases damage by 33%. This is very difficult to accomplish without the use of abilities, however, as there are only two items that provide armor reduction - Stark's Fervor (20) and Black Cleaver (12 per stack for a total of 60). Most champions innately get up to 70-80 armor simply by leveling, so unless you have another ability that reduces armor, you're not going to get it much below -10.

Hypothetically, the lowest you could get someone's armor would be:

- 20 (starks) - 60 (BC) - 50 (Corki Gatling) - 40 (Nasus Spirit Fire) - 26 (Eve Ravage) - 30 (Taric Shatter) - 35 (Karthus Wall of Pain) = -261, off of someone's minimum base armor of I believe 7 = -254, for a 71.75% increase in damage (of course, since they'd be level one this would probably instagib them just putting all those debuffs on them)


Edit:

Also, Lawful, you are way off. Waaaay off. Penetrates 40% of the target's armor. It really can't be any clearer. Armor * .4 = the amount of armor penetrated. If you want to do this with a division to get the ending armor, you'd start by taking .6 (what the armor remains at) and then take the reciprocal of that, which is 1.667. So yeah, 80/1.667 = ~48, which is 32 penetration, which is 40% of the starting armor penetrated.

Seriously, learn to math. I'll go and test this in a practice game to show you if you're going to be stubborn on this.


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Lawful

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Senior Member

06-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tewnam View Post
I think at this point you're just trolling, but I'll bite.
Aw, caught already? ;( <3


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Ebonclaw

Senior Member

06-22-2010

You.... do realize that Armor Pen actually gives you a (compounding) Linear increase in damage as well?

Every 1 point of penetration increases existing damage by 1%.


However, criticals actually give you a decreasing damage increase from every point. That is, the first point of crit gives you 1% increase, the second point gives you .99% increase, and so forth, up until going from 99% crit to 100% crit only technically increases existing damage by ~.5% (not counting crit damage increases, ie Bloodlust or IE).


However, you can not compare 1 point of armor pen to 1% crit - the opportunity costs are different, and the item synergies are different.

You have to first determine the approximate relative cost of Pen vs Crit, THEN you have to postulate build sets focusing on one stat or the other, and compare real results based on real rune/mastery builds and real item purchases at say the 7000g or 8000g mark.

Anything else is intellectual diarrhea at best, and completely misleading fantasy at worst.


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RagnarokChu

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Senior Member

06-22-2010

You are aware that armor peneration makes your crits hit harder.


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Lawful

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06-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by RagnarokChu View Post
You are aware that armor peneration makes your crits hit harder.
Nah, really?