AP katarina or AD katarina??

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Crayon Puppet

Senior Member

06-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Petnavi View Post
AD since it's better overall. AD affects her Q and R plus her auto attack. At 1 bfs your Q could do 200-300 damage. Also, a good set up is: regrowth, bfs , magic pen boots, bfs, the slowing scepter then stack blood thristers

Edit: Also, she takes down towers really fast with AD
AP affects her e and r and can make much better use out of magic pen than u can with ad, rylais actually makes sense, and u can get more hp as a AP than u can afford to get as AD if u want to maximize damage on your ult, AD gives u more lanning control and auto farm, but with the nerf on bouncing blade range I think I rather go ap


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Crayon Puppet

Senior Member

06-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Itorbeh View Post
Because she can be dynamically played both ways there exists a lot of room for debate against them both.

The truth is until you try them both and find out for yourself which one holds best to your playstyle either one could be best.

And that's the interesting thing I would like to reflect upon is that I have seen both do well, I find however AP Kat to be the most deadly and frustrating because her burst potential exists both in 1v1 AND in groups, Kat's ulti can still be used 1v1, remember that

Hope it's helped you out a bit, oh and Rylai's can make one heck of a difference with her ulti as it means people will be in it for longer.
yea i think Kat is one of the more successfully designed heroes in which her alternative builds are both very useful and can make a that much better of a player if you can read any team composition and make the right decision as to playing AD or AP, imo you should definitely know the pro and cons of boths builds and master them if you are a kat player


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peyo

Senior Member

06-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by rximmortal View Post
Facts:
Playing AD - You die easy no matter what you collect.
Playing Tank - You can't die but you do nothing and everyone ignores you.
Playing AP - You die hard (with the right build)
I wonder how ^^ as an AP you have to be inside the battle to do anything, while AD can harrass from outside. Also, you can get the same HP items with AD as you take with AP, so...


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McRofls

Senior Member

06-25-2010

I'm like 21-6 with Katarina, only played her in 5s so far. I think that's a pretty good score but I'm by no means "top tier" or whatever you gents brag about these days.

I've mainly focused on AD but I am starting to learn how to play AP... both are nice.

AD: Bouncing Blade is ridiculous, and it harasses MUCH better early game than AP can. This is mainly why I liked AD better, you can harass better and take down towers -- something my teams usually seem to lack.

AP: Better survivability and I feel that you get less "wasted" items. Almost every game you have to get Merc Treds for the CC reduction, so then you have to buy Haunting Guise for the Magic Penetration. If you're AP... boom, that's more stats you can use. Plus Rylais being a core item every game is amazing. You can still harass, just be clever and use your shunpo then run into a bush/wait til they used their skill on a minion.

Cliffs: AD if your team needs tower pushing or they have a Veigar; AP if you need survivability.


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FABIOForever

Senior Member

06-25-2010

I honestly don't see how there's any debate. AD is far, far superior in pretty much every way possible.

As far as Death Lotus goes, both AD and AP scale the damage about the same, so lets say they're even in that department and look at others.

With AD:

1. You do more damage auto attacking when your abilities are on cooldown.
2. You have much better lane harassing.
3. You take down turrets faster.
4. Most importantly, you FARM so much faster. This is so important and should honestly be the end of the debate right there. You're going to be making so much more money with an AD build than AP it's not even funny.


The extra shunpo damage you get out of an AP build is negligible compared to the extra damage an AD build is going to give you with bouncing blades and auto attack.

The only, ONLY good thing about an AP build is getting a Rylais, but honestly you shouldn't need it. Instead of relying on Rylais like a crutch, you should practice positioning and timing in fights so that when you strike, you won't NEED the slow to kill everyone with death lotus. If you find yourself still needing a slow, take exhaust as a spell (casting it won't interrupt death lotus).

I really wouldn't trust that "pro" Katarina guide someone linked to. Any guide that tells you to get Warmogs is suspect (it really is a crappy item), plus I view survivability on Katarina like I do the slow from Rylai's; you should be positioning and timing yourself so that you don't even need it. Death Lotus AFTER a fight has started and things are too chaotic for the enemy to effectively focus you. That guide says to not even get sorc boots until 5000+ gold into the game, telling you to buy 2 BF swords first when the magic penetration from sorc boots is an insanely better value for increased damage.

Don't bother with survivability, don't bother with merc treads or anything else but increasing your bouncing blade and death lotus damage. If you're not slaughtering people with death lotus then why are you playing Katarina? There is no point to tanking Kat and doing pathetic damage with death lotus. At best you're simply not dying and in that case you're actually contributing less to the team than an AFK. The only survivability item that remotely makes sense for Kat is banshee veil. You waste a little money on the mana bonus but it's still a much better value than Warmogs.

You can call building nothing but sorc boots + BF swords boring, but there really isn't a more effective strategy for Katarina.


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Sailor Moon

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Senior Member

06-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by FABIOForever View Post
I honestly don't see how there's any debate. AD is far, far superior in pretty much every way possible.

As far as Death Lotus goes, both AD and AP scale the damage about the same, so lets say they're even in that department and look at others.

With AD:

1. You do more damage auto attacking when your abilities are on cooldown.
2. You have much better lane harassing.
3. You take down turrets faster.
4. Most importantly, you FARM so much faster. This is so important and should honestly be the end of the debate right there. You're going to be making so much more money with an AD build than AP it's not even funny.


The extra shunpo damage you get out of an AP build is negligible compared to the extra damage an AD build is going to give you with bouncing blades and auto attack.

The only, ONLY good thing about an AP build is getting a Rylais, but honestly you shouldn't need it. Instead of relying on Rylais like a crutch, you should practice positioning and timing in fights so that when you strike, you won't NEED the slow to kill everyone with death lotus. If you find yourself still needing a slow, take exhaust as a spell (casting it won't interrupt death lotus).

I really wouldn't trust that "pro" Katarina guide someone linked to. Any guide that tells you to get Warmogs is suspect (it really is a crappy item), plus I view survivability on Katarina like I do the slow from Rylai's; you should be positioning and timing yourself so that you don't even need it. Death Lotus AFTER a fight has started and things are too chaotic for the enemy to effectively focus you. That guide says to not even get sorc boots until 5000+ gold into the game, telling you to buy 2 BF swords first when the magic penetration from sorc boots is an insanely better value for increased damage.

Don't bother with survivability, don't bother with merc treads or anything else but increasing your bouncing blade and death lotus damage. If you're not slaughtering people with death lotus then why are you playing Katarina? There is no point to tanking Kat and doing pathetic damage with death lotus. At best you're simply not dying and in that case you're actually contributing less to the team than an AFK. The only survivability item that remotely makes sense for Kat is banshee veil. You waste a little money on the mana bonus but it's still a much better value than Warmogs.

You can call building nothing but sorc boots + BF swords boring, but there really isn't a more effective strategy for Katarina.

that guide is the single best guide for katarina written in terms of details, build, and how much testing was put into it. for high elo anyway. however; unfortunately it is a little outdated. please do not flame someone who deserves respect for an outdated guide :x


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Fireblac

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Junior Member

06-25-2010

I pretty much completely agree with everything FABIOForever said.

Kat is my main and always will be. I've tried both AP, AD and Hybrid builds on her and AD is just far superior. Plus as AD Kat, if you get the hang of it almost no one can take mid from you. After you get your first BF sword in mid and you do killier instincts then bouncing blades on a minion then shunpo onto the lowest one then just auto attack a few times the whole wave is gone within seconds and if you do it right you can last hit them all with minimal effort. Also you have a good chance of hitting the enemy while just killing off creep waves so its a win win. The only champ that ever gives me any trouble or has even ever taken mid from me was a Heimerdinger but he gives almost everyone trouble.

One morething about AD Kat is I normally get around 2-4 thirsters each game and after you get 4 with your normal attack and quite slow attack speed you will be able to just shumpo onto enemies, and kill them by auto attacking. You could even go toe to toe with them, without even using our ult, if they decide to stand and fight because of all of your vamp. Plus your bouncing blades will do atleast a quarter of everyones health if they aren't tanks. Now lets face it your shumpo will tickle people end game but its still amazing skill for AD kat for catching people, last hitting, initiating and running away. Remember now, Lizard buff+Shunpo->normal attack=win. As AD Kat you should always be getting one of the neutral buffs and it doesn't really matter which one because they are both great on her but remember sometimes other carries or healers on your team might need them more than you. To wrap it up your Death Lotus will be insane and sometimes make people ragequit.

I might have said too much but I can't help but laugh when I see an AP Kats and ones who thinks they are good, especialy when we go hit for hit with our ults and they end up dying when I still have over half of my hp left.

The best advice I can now offer you is keep trying AP vs AD out and compare them. I hate AP kat but maybe when you see the difference in power between the two you will really understand AD is the way to go. Otherwise slap on some thirsters and start pwning. If you ever need help with Kat message me here or in game, i'd love to help more.


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Sharkpower

Senior Member

06-25-2010

AD because BB harassment is boss.


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junchurriki

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Member

06-25-2010

AD FTW!!!! it s far better than AP..i've played against an AP kat and killed her easily with an AD kat. AD seems a little cheaper cuz u wont need much stuff to power up ur skills.


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Munkiemann

Senior Member

06-25-2010

people judging AD > AP by how they beat an AP kat isn't a viable way of saying AD is better then AP. In different situations ad is better, and sometimes ap is better. Both can be good.


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