Why Lee Sin is NOT overpowered

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Ploutus

Senior Member

09-20-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pizza Soldier View Post
being hard to use is not an excuse to be super strong

see annie compared to ezreal
So you are saying Ezreal does a ton of Damage and is super strong but hard to play? I defiantly disagree. I have played and carried countless games as Annie, Ezreal, and Lee SIn.

Annie takes NO skill to play. I have done well with her completely ****faced drunk.
Ezreal takes a decent amount of skill to play and has decent damage to compensate. Lee Sin takes a lot of skill to play and has a lot of damage to compensate. If anything Ezreal us UP, Annie is OP, and Lee Sin is Balanced.


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StrengthAndHonor

Senior Member

09-20-2011

Lee Sin needs nerfs

Ezreal is just fine where he is.

Annie is fine.


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Kaeoz

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Senior Member

09-20-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bland View Post
Ok, let me put it differently...
Would you think it would be fun playing a game where all players in both teams have exactly the same hero who doesn't have skills and can only right-click? Obviously now it would be balanced, and the tactical skills would be the thing that wins the game.
Ok, this is a little bit exaggerated, but I think you get my point. Putting it simple: Being versatile make the game funner to play.

That's why I'm saying that skillcaps should basically be higher... I'd like all champions to be able to do what he can do (not literally, skillwise... just in regards to the power) if he's played well.
See, what makes him so fun to play isn't necessarily his power, but his set of skills and linked with that his skilllcap. He is incredibly dynamic, he's versatile... And as I explained, if you nerf him now, give it some time and he will end up losing his dynamic playstyle to make him easier to use, so he's on par with other champs. And I don't want that to happen.

Let's exaggerate again: Imagine a game with 10 "Lee Sins"... different skills and stuff, but versatile and tricky to use... Wouldn't you want to play that game?

It's a large challenge to balance a game that has champions with high skill caps, but I'd rather have Riot take the challenge instead of simplifying everything to the extent that I could just be playing chess (I like playing chess about as much as playing LoL... but out of different reasons, and I'd like those to stay different reasons)
I'd love it if the overall skill cap required to play could be raised unfortunately for riot, that doesn't make money. Its one thing for low elo players to suck at 1 champion... but to suck at them all? Say bye bye to >50% of riot's profits right there... You have to remember, while you may WANT skill caps to be higher, you have to anchor the pinnacle of your argument to reality. Riot needs money. Casual games make much much much more profit than competitive games unless you create the next starcraft (for obvious reasons simply because easier to play/get into = more customers).

So no, higher skill caps is truly not a realistic situation... and we can't raise other champions' power levels because that'd create a lot of power creep... Yes... it'd be nice to have a game where not every champion feels like autopilot (like annie...) but its not realistic. Thus, the game needs to cater to both the skilled AND the non skilled (its not very fun sucking at everything).

Essentially, there are two options, keep lee sin's skill cap and lower his power making him suck for low elo players or raise the skill cap/power of other champions and alienate half the player base. (Notice that raising the power level without raising the skill cap of other champions is NOT possible since all that does is make everything with a low skill cap super super super OP in low elo which also alienates the player base in low elo...)

I'm sure riot cares about their profits and the bottom line is that they're a business... thus, the former is far far far better for attracting a wider audience (because 1 useless champion for 1/2 your player base is far better than 80 useless champions).

tldr; low-skill capped champions HAVE to exist and in the interest of making as many champions viable in competitive play as possible and also to cater to a wider playerbase, they need to make sure that high skill cap does not directly translate into a stronger champion (as is the case of lee sin).


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Lyriac

Senior Member

09-20-2011

Whilst everyone is talking about his skill shot nobody just pointing out that he's supposed to be an assassin of sorts but can be played like a bruiser.

Bruisers should not have that sort of mobility, everyone complains about Irelia being uncatchable and ruining teamfights.
Lee Sin kind of takes the cake, honestly.


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BootyClaps4Jesus

Senior Member

09-20-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Fry View Post
It's a pretty fast skillshot, you have to predict it perfectly or flash away to avoid it. If skillshots were as easy to dodge as you make it seem to be, Ezreal would be the absolute most useless champion in the game.
He finally understands!


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Nosticlol

Senior Member

09-20-2011

Lee Sin was trained by Jesse Perring.

If you guys continue to whine Jesse Perring will roundhouse kick you all off the forums and into your beds with a pacifier and a blanket.



tl;dr
Jesse Perring.

P.S.
Jesse Perring

P.P.S
Jesse Perring.


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Frozenfire

Member

09-20-2011

I thought he was going to say something like:
Why lee sin isn't overpowered:




Cause hes blind.

zzzz


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BACKSTABUUU

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Senior Member

09-20-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyriac View Post
Whilst everyone is talking about his skill shot nobody just pointing out that he's supposed to be an assassin of sorts but can be played like a bruiser.

Bruisers should not have that sort of mobility, everyone complains about Irelia being uncatchable and ruining teamfights.
Lee Sin kind of takes the cake, honestly.
Problem is, Lee has to get down and dirty to be of any use, if you take too much survivability away, he's going to end up like Riven, too squishy to output damage.


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EbonyKnife

Senior Member

09-20-2011

Theres no reason they can't tone down his earlygame (if only somewhat). He will still have his survivability in teamfights and lategame utility.

Its what they did to gangplank. He was ridiculous earlygame with 5 stack passive and cleared jungle ridiculously fast. They nerfed his earlygame, but hes just as good lategame with his teambuff, so hes still a viable and powerful champion. Plus hes still good as an earlygame ganker, even if he can't clear jungle quite as well.


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Longshot405

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Senior Member

09-20-2011

Determining a champion's power isn't based on skill cap. Yes, having a high skill cap is a reason to give those certain abilities a bit more reward for using correctly, but not to a point that they are too strong.

The point is, champions need to be balanced based on what they are capable of doing. Not on the average ability of the champ. You will never hear a Red say "Most people who play this champ cannot use his full potential, so it's okay that the few players who can reach his full potential can completely stomp anyone else with ease."