The thornmail just blows...

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YesManKABLAAM

Senior Member

08-30-2011

Im sorry but seriously...the thornmail friggin blows....... You actually need more items to make the thornmail actually useful. and yea, and no. The thornmail just doesnt work against gp or trynd. The thornmail blows, thats my opinion, I know im probably doing it wrong but idc, the thornmail blows once again...


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zelosse

Senior Member

08-30-2011

You have no ****ing clue what a thornmail is or does. Build health, get a thornmail, laugh at AD carries being useless against you. It needs a god **** nerf because it straight up ruins an AD ANYTHINGS game almost entirely, obvious counters like lifesteal dont work against it at all because you need MORE lifesteal to actually get your health BACK.
Screw you troll.


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Rawrful

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Senior Member

08-30-2011

Thornmail is interesting. Sometimes it utterly shuts down AD, sometimes it is too little too late. I've had games as a phys carry where the enemy rushes Thornmails and I was useless all game, because they got them so early that I was totally shut down.

I've also played games as a phys carry where I got fed early, and they bought Thornmails to try to counter me. In this situation tometimes it works, but often the fed carry has, say, IE/Phantom/Last Whisper and a bit of lifesteal and just blows apart the guy who spent his hard earned money on a thornmail.

Essentially, it works REALLY well if you are ahead because it shuts down non-fed champions hard because they can't even afford to attack you. It works ok if the game is even because it is a big hunk of Armor. It works poorly if you are losing because it isn't the most cost effective item you could be buying when your opponent already has armor pen, damage and lifesteal.


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Enraged Pickle

Member

08-30-2011

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Thornmail is one of those items that you need to buy intelligently and counter intelligently against as well. Buying Thornmail to counter Tryndamere isn't the best idea. Getting Frozen Heart or Omen is better. Slowing that his attack speed is more useful for everyone than reflecting damage that Tryndamere doesn't care about. If you see an enemy with a Thornmail, it means don't attack them. Usually tank or off-tank grab a Thornmail, well if they do then ignore them. If its someone like Xin who is a pretty strong threat. But I don't understand why would Xin need Thornmail anyways. Lets just say he has one for the heck of it. If you weren't already being raped by Xin and being tossed in the air and actually beating Xin to begin with, grab some life steal. The damage reflected is only 30% after reduction. A Bloodthirster or some other lifesteal item is all you need to even out the passive.

Plus Thornmail isn't even that great of an item. Its nice in some situation but not always. Sunfire deals 40 damage or so? So in a Thornmail sense, you need to take 133 damage to reflect 40 damage. The 133 damage is after damage reduction, so the original attack of the attacker would need something like 266 with 50% reduction. (Example, Annie at level 1 with Thornmail has a little over 50% physical damage reduction). Hence, if you have 50% armor, you'll need the enemy to deal 266 damage to reflect 40 damage back. That isn't very useful overall, if its a balance team where its not AD heavy. Thornmail isn't good for the cost at all, You're not dealing damage to everyone at the same rate. If you grab Sunfire, which cost more, it will deal a constant 35-40 damage for the early game. It helps you farm too; more than Thornmail.

I don't understand where all this complaining is from. Do the math, do the theorycrafting, play the game and observe what is actually happening before you complain.


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PhailRaptor

Adjudicator

08-30-2011

As I corrected in the other thread, Thronmail determines the damage it reflects before Armor is taken into account. Lifesteal, on the other hand, takes effect after Armor. Lifesteal is not a counter to Thornmail -- MR and Arpen are.


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Lumovanis

Senior Member

08-31-2011

Though thornmail's damage is reduced by magic resistance... which is nearly self defeating unto itself.