@Tryndamere/Riot Regarding Riot's focus for LoL/General Observations

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Coltsbro

Junior Member

08-04-2011

First of all, I want to congratulate Riot for finishing something they're obviously really excited about and have been working on for a long time. Dominion does look fun, but I will hold my reservations until I actually play it. I do have a couple of concerns I would like addressed, however.

1) The Twisted Treeline effect. Riot has already experimented with a new map/game mode with TT, and it has failed drastically. LoL is balanced around Summoner's Rift and competitive gameplay, and tried to incorporate that with TT and failed. Many people have been clamoring for a new 5v5 map to play competitively on, as the same map does get VERY tiring after a while (looking at Magma Chamber). Instead we get another map that is focused on a completely different gameplay type, and isn't meant to be competitive. I understand the market for this, but it simply is NOT big enough to prioritize this over something like Magma Chamber, which a majority of the player base would play more frequently than Dominion. Can you provide any solid reasons that will keep people playing Dominion regularly over SR, other than "Wait until you play it and see it at PAX?"

2) Priority of content released. As we have all discussed over the time we have played LoL, many features have been promised, announced, and then put in a priority list. I would like explanations of why things like Tribunal and Mastery Pages were put ahead of major, MAJOR features like Magma Chamber, Project Shiny, and other such features. I understand the staffing issues, but why not focus your recruiting efforts extremely hard on positions to get these features done, than continuing to hire community people and people who can code Tribunal (which is flawed) and Mastery Pages (only client side). It just seems confusing to me that Riot wants to put out small, meaningless features in the long and short run, instead of putting out major stuff that will stick with players and improve the quality and depth of the game.

3) Seemingly hypocritical statements. Riot states they want to be open, they want to be in touch with the community, and provide updates that will make players happy. However, when players ask for updates and other such information, they are met with either trolling or something along the lines of "Soon, we have many things we have coming out but can't talk about yet! Trust us, it's coming Soon^TM." We all know the jokes, but to be honest Riot should never have let it get to the point where Soon has become a community meme. I understand the need to keep secrets from competitors, but the least you could do is give some general hints or general info, nothing specific. Say, "we're working on a feature that would bring a different feel to the 5v5 competitive environment, trying to spruce up and excite players." Doesn't that sound a lot better than, "We can't tell you, but Soon!"

4) Rioters seemingly trolling players/posters on forums. I understand that many employees at Riot are/were players and forum goers before they were hired at Riot, but this does not give them the excuse to go troll posters. As Red's, they are looked at for information and important posts, thus held to a higher standard. I am fairly skilled in marketing and PR, and if I saw a company blatantly lying and trolling their customers, I would tend to shy away from their business. I'm not saying they cannot have fun, but when it comes to stuff like Balance, Features, Gameplay, or other similar avenues, it is unacceptable for Riot to go around trolling.

With all that said, for a company as young as Riot is, they are doing a wonderful job. They do have some major areas to improve on, but what young company does. They do have a wonderful relationship with the community, which is fairly rare. Very rarely does a company President interact with the customers on such a regular and personal basis. I applaud Riot for this, and wish them the best in the future. I just wish some of these points would be addressed and discussed seriously.


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Scrumpy Jack

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Senior Member

08-04-2011

Well said. Can't +1 this hard enough.


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Kwicherbichn

Senior Member

08-04-2011

Dude well freakin' said bro. I couldn't put it in better terms. I really like what Riot did with LoL and I enjoy the game alot. I don't know why there is a 3v3 to be honest tho, I myself have not even touched it so I guess I should STFU there, but a new map for 5v5 would be awesome.

Googled pictures of this so called "Magma Chamber" the concept of that map looks freakin wicked sweet, wish it will be pushed out to release...

On the topic tho...Riot needs to improve in various aspects of the way they do things. They have a great game but that only does not make up for their lack of support and frustrating forum post. Also what you OP have stated about Mods in a forum post, I read that and go WTF did a "Red" seriously post this? It's not cool to tell your customers "Oh it'll be here soon" or whatever your excuse is.

Alot of hot titles approaching soon, if Riot doesn't clean up their act, they'll lose that fancy "15mil subscribers" faster than getting ganked by Annie bot. Riot, you were gamers at one point so you know how it feels, don't be jerks.


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SoBeNirvana

Adjudicator

08-04-2011

Quote:
1) The Twisted Treeline effect. Riot has already experimented with a new map/game mode with TT, and it has failed drastically. LoL is balanced around Summoner's Rift and competitive gameplay, and tried to incorporate that with TT and failed. Many people have been clamoring for a new 5v5 map to play competitively on, as the same map does get VERY tiring after a while (looking at Magma Chamber). Instead we get another map that is focused on a completely different gameplay type, and isn't meant to be competitive. I understand the market for this, but it simply is NOT big enough to prioritize this over something like Magma Chamber, which a majority of the player base would play more frequently than Dominion. Can you provide any solid reasons that will keep people playing Dominion regularly over SR, other than "Wait until you play it and see it at PAX?"
I shall explain to you why this is wrong:

The problems with Twisted Treeline mostly involved the item shop. Firstly, tank items are balanced around damage soak from 5 enemies. There are only three enemies on Twisted Treeline. This created an inherent imbalance that would not be solved by anything besides changing the items for each map. This will happen on Crystal Scar, and the changes are going to recursively affect Twisted Treeline with altered gold and shop content there, either - so I don't see any future problems with balance on new maps.

Secondary - Magma Chamber, while still interesting, is problematic because the map would have far more emphasis on laning and pushing. This would make the "never-ending farm" problem even more pronounced on that map, when sustain is figured in. The longer game time would also make the game far less interesting as a spectator sport, which they are trying to solve as a problem on all maps.

You also run into the problem of new maps build around "more or less of what's in Rift." Twisted Treeline has less lane and more jungle, and Magma Chamber has less jungle and more lane. The overall difference in feel probably wouldn't be enough to justify the huge amount of work Magma Chamber would need for rather small payoff of "Summoner's Rift with a few changes".

Overall, they made the right decision in shelving Magma Chamber for Crystal Scar, I think.


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srsizzy

Senior Member

08-04-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoBeNirvana View Post
You also run into the problem of new maps build around "more or less of what's in Rift." Twisted Treeline has less lane and more jungle, and Magma Chamber has less jungle and more lane. The overall difference in feel probably wouldn't be enough to justify the huge amount of work Magma Chamber would need for rather small payoff of "Summoner's Rift with a few changes".
What are you talking about? Magma chamber had like 6 extra jungle camps. Magma Chamber was designed for regular small skirmishes in the jungle and in the lanes, because they are too far apart to be effectively ganked the way SR lanes are.

This sounds exciting and interesting, allows for the option of two junglers instead of one, allows for roaming to be a much more interesting dynamic, yada yada. I think you're basically wrong, MC wouldn't be as much like SR as you think, but yes, I understand why they made Domion instead.


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SoBeNirvana

Adjudicator

08-04-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by srsizzy View Post
What are you talking about? Magma chamber had like 6 extra jungle camps. Magma Chamber was designed for regular small skirmishes in the jungle and in the lanes, because they are too far apart to be effectively ganked the way SR lanes are.

This sounds exciting and interesting, allows for the option of two junglers instead of one, allows for roaming to be a much more interesting dynamic, yada yada. I think you're basically wrong, MC wouldn't be as much like SR as you think, but yes, I understand why they made Domion instead.
I personally want both, but I think it's a better idea to launch a new mode and try to balance Twisted Treeline before attempting a third Tower Defense map.