#1 Method of Escaping ELO Hell

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sn3aks

Senior Member

06-08-2011

wathcing streams of top players... does not help you so much in elo hell. i mean you can play very well, and lose in elo hell for no fualt of your own. people keep saying there are ways to play different that will allow you to win games with 2 leavers and 4 feeders... but i dont ever see them say how, and no streams show you how.


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Antnerd

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Member

06-08-2011

I just lost a game I was carrying. HARD. 2 shotting the tank. We lost 1 teamfight midgame. Surrender vote succeeded 4 to 1!

What more can I do?


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sn3aks

Senior Member

06-08-2011

yea man i know the feeling... id like to know how your supposed to win a game where the team score is 1 to 24 by the 14 min mark and you have the only kill, and all of your teammates are feeding and losing towers?


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Dr rAndOm

Senior Member

06-08-2011

A game is a product to make fun. I won't blame myself as long as I am doing the right thing. It's just like doing a business: only the success proves things out. In such a teamwork game, there is no point to blame urself for those bad guys in ur team. As long as you are real good, your friends at the same level will understand you and need you.

About 5% of those smart guys can be good with only 200 - 300 wins and they act like 600 - 700 wins players. On the other side... some people still play as beginners with 600 wins or more. I ever see a 1100 wins player focused on anivia at the start gank in 3v3 map. I told my friend he was bad. This guy cried and left. Probably a beginner was using that account.

Anyway, a 200 wins player normally wont care much about the evaluations from 30 wins players. When a 1000 wins player watch 200 win players... it's the same thing. If u ever see a 200 wins player act like a 30 wins player.. Don't be surprised... There r always ppl who dont learn. That's why we should remember that we are always nubs for better players. if a guy thinks wins mean nothing.. he does need to check the players on the ladder... just check how many games they ever play averagely...


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Zyphier

Senior Member

06-09-2011

@ sn3aks

If you won't even watch streams then you're wasting the best resource for improving your game. It's the same for DotA where they had replays.

There was a very good quote on the forums before.

The difference between high ELO and low ELO players is that high ELO players know who is stronger, while low ELO players find out who is stronger.

This is very important skill in this game, recognizing opportunities and situations. It transfers on from watching to your games. If you just play your game, you will miss out a lot of details since you are concentrated on playing your game. Take team fights for example. If you play a team fight, you have to concentrate on your role, try not to die and focus on aiming your spells or skill shots. When you watch a team fight on stream, you don't have to concentrate on those things, you see the team fight from a third persons view. You see who casts their spells on who, who is positioning themselves correctly, how people reposition themselves when they are caught and so on. You learn if you should dive for your enemy carries, or just protect your own carries. You learn that sometimes it is the right move to hit the tank, because hitting the enemy carries is too dangerous / not worth it.

Streams also teach you good item builds. I'm not sure what your item builds are right now, but its easy to lose games because you didn't build it optimally, when the enemy carry did. If both of you get the same amount of gold, the one who buys smarter items will ultimately be stronger.

This game has quite a steep learning curve if you want to be good. A lot of people don't realize the little details you need to be good at the game. Take streams seriously, and I promise you won't regret it.

And yes, even though a lot of times it is not your fault, just pinning the blame on team mates does not drive you to improve yourself. Ask yourself, do you think you would get better if at the end of a game you lost, say your teammates did badly and just play the next game? Or would you improve much more, if you kept asking yourself what you could have done better? Did you pick the right lanes to gank? Should you have farmed up when your teammates were having trouble? The faster you want to improve your game, the less you will have to rely on even match ups. If you're good, you can turn the entire enemy team into feeders.

Also, finding people to duo queue at low ELO is harder, most of the do not communicate much at that level.

@ Antnerd

Keep playing. If you carry like that every game, you will easily rise in ELO. If you don't, then ask yourself why you don't carry like that every single game. I never said its easy to escape ELO hell, I just said you got to be mentally prepared to do so.

@ Dr rAndOm

Taken from my reply to sn3aks.

Even though a lot of times it is not your fault, just pinning the blame on team mates does not drive you to improve yourself. Ask yourself, do you think you would get better if at the end of a game you lost, say your teammates did badly and just play the next game? Or would you improve much more, if you kept asking yourself what you could have done better? Did you pick the right lanes to gank? Should you have farmed up when your teammates were having trouble? The faster you want to improve your game, the less you will have to rely on even match ups. If you're good, you can turn the entire enemy team into feeders.


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Be Nice Eric

Senior Member

06-09-2011

Yep, the OP is correct. There's a good book out there called The Sixth Discipline about how to learn, and different mental blocks to learning.

One of the mental blocks is "The enemy is out there!" syndrome, and prevents ppl from realizing that sometimes the enemy is within and can be defeated easily once discovered.


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Dr rAndOm

Senior Member

06-09-2011

@Zyphier:

"This is very important skill in this game, recognizing opportunities and situations."

I agree with this claim. It's probably the origin that it is so hard for beginners to understand good players. From my side, there is only 5% I get better teammates in solo games. Therefore, I am right 95% of the time. In such a teamwok game, you can't make conclusions without teamwork. In a solo game... how much teamwork you think we may have? And how do you cheat yourself to be like a beginner? I'm not intelligent enough to do teamwork with some super bad begnners and good players at the same time. I dont think I would consider " oh im in a nub team" or " oh my friends r here n they r all good" before I act. If this takes me 1 sec to think about it, then I will lose most of the opportunities in game. If you r not intelligent enough like I am, making teamwork with beginners will just make you another coward player rather than learning anything from solo games and beginners. Do you think coward player can make good teamwork? ^ ^ I do know ithat m not good enough and im improving something all the time for sure.


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Zyphier

Senior Member

06-09-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr rAndOm View Post
@Zyphier:

"This is very important skill in this game, recognizing opportunities and situations."

I agree with this claim. It's probably the origin that it is so hard for beginners to understand good players. From my side, there is only 5% I get better teammates in solo games. Therefore, I am right 95% of the time. In such a teamwok game, you can't make conclusions without teamwork. In a solo game... how much teamwork you think we may have? And how do you cheat yourself to be like a beginner? I'm not intelligent enough to do teamwork with some super bad begnners and good players at the same time. I dont think I would consider " oh im in a nub team" or " oh my friends r here n they r all good" before I act. If this takes me 1 sec to think about it, then I will lose most of the opportunities in game. If you r not intelligent enough like I am, making teamwork with beginners will just make you another coward player rather than learning anything from solo games and beginners. Do you think coward player can make good teamwork? ^ ^ I do know ithat m not good enough and im improving something all the time for sure.
You provided the answer to your question. If you really are 95% of the time than your team mates, then make all the calls. Team work is one thing, planning is another, and what you describing is that you fear that your teammates are all on different game levels at 1200's, and so its impossible to get them all to work together. Well, actually it isn't. Make the calls then, ping a lot when there are opportunities. People usually listen to calls if they agree and the calls are persistent enough. You are lucky no one takes the lead in ELO hell, if you think you make decisions then you can lead easily. It's so much better than

a) no one makes calls and everyone just plays their own game, expecting teamwork out of nowhere,
b) some other guy worse than you makes the calls but is very bad at it, thus losing many fights else.

Be persistent. Type out the idea behind the plan. Ping a lot. People eventually get the message. If their jungler is top lane and you think you can win dragon at that point, type out "Enemy jungler is at top lane, we can get the kill on dragon easily without their smiter around". Then proceed to ping. It works, seriously.

Take some initiative. If you actually think you are better than everyone 95% of the time, then make the effort to influence the game more.


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sn3aks

Senior Member

06-09-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zyphier View Post
@ sn3aks

If you won't even watch streams then you're wasting the best resource for improving your game. It's the same for DotA where they had replays.
i watch streams, they just don't show me how to win in low elo... its hard to advance this when people just assume stuff is the worst possible case... tell me would a player with my history in games not watch stearms, or course not, and i didnt say that i did not watch steams.


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Zyphier

Senior Member

06-09-2011

Your item builds are pretty okay, I'll give you that much. You probably aren't getting Banshee's Veil / Quicksilver Sash enough for your AD carries though.

Streams teach you about team fights. They teach you about opportunities. I've already told you about the details you have to pay attention to previously, and streams help you notice them.

You seem to be dying quite a bit even as an AD carry. You are not supposed to do that. Aim for 0 deaths each game, I have a feeling you are taking way too many risks for kills. Yes I know sometimes you have to risk dying in team games, but from your score thats way over the mark. 3-4 deaths each game is as high as it should go (unless you get like 20+ kills).


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