[Guide] Kassadin

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kijik

Senior Member

02-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bait View Post
nope. pretty bad.
he can't harass effectively until he gets rift walk. his only way of harass vs ranged is his void sphere.
until void sphere is lvl 3, it's not a good damage per mp,

against a melee, he might do okay. overall, bad.
uhhh...wrong? you can ask anyone that plays with my kass, he's a fine solo, point of the solo is to level and try to kill the other solo, which he does well at 6.

tear of the goddess is also a fail =(

tryin ta hustle in on my territory.


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Quick Sand

Member

02-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by kijik View Post
uhhh...wrong? you can ask anyone that plays with my kass, he's a fine solo, point of the solo is to level and try to kill the other solo, which he does well at 6.

tear of the goddess is also a fail =(

tryin ta hustle in on my territory.

I agree he is a fine solo. His purpose there is certainly to kill the other champion b/c he's obviously not a bigtime farmer. With this said, I think he requires more situational awareness and number-crunching to get it done as a solo because you can't waste your chance to kill.

I never play him anything other than solo and I can normally get a kill before level 6 with some null sphere harasses then popping pulse which i max first. Throw in an ignite and you're good to go. My main problem comes with heroes like Tristana or other ranged heroes who go lifesteal and are smart. At that point you have to adjust and realize killing is probably not likely. And I'm fairly high elo I believe.

Also to solo effectively, the last thing you want do is go defensive masteries. Mix utility and offense so that you can be a better killer


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AIM7Sparrow

Senior Member

02-22-2010

Alright, first of all, you people need to learn to differentiate between "able to solo and not die" and "a good solo."

Kassadin is NOT "a good solo."

Kassadin CAN "solo and not die."

Learn the difference.

Second of all, people tend to use personal instances as evidence but in all reality, it really doesn't mean anything. "But I first blooded in 2 minutes with my Kass and ended up 15-0-10 with 500 AP solo mid even though there was a Cardmaster, Nidalee, Anivia, and Sivir on my team omfg Kass is obviously such a good solo mid."

No.


Melee attack
One reliable harass spell
Terrible farming capability
Squishy with no heal


He is NOT a good solo mid. You are hurting your team if you take mid over a carry who has more or less equatable skill to your own.


Lastly, tear is not fail. =P


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Quick Sand

Member

02-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sniperness View Post
Alright, first of all, you people need to learn to differentiate between "able to solo and not die" and "a good solo."

Kassadin is NOT "a good solo."

Kassadin CAN "solo and not die."

Learn the difference.

Second of all, people tend to use personal instances as evidence but in all reality, it really doesn't mean anything. "But I first blooded in 2 minutes with my Kass and ended up 15-0-10 with 500 AP solo mid even though there was a Cardmaster, Nidalee, Anivia, and Sivir on my team omfg Kass is obviously such a good solo mid."

No.


Melee attack
One reliable harass spell
Terrible farming capability
Squishy with no heal


He is NOT a good solo mid. You are hurting your team if you take mid over a carry who has more or less equatable skill to your own.


Lastly, tear is not fail. =P
Let's be real here. You're blowing it out of proportion. No one said he was one of the better solos; it's simply doable on a consistent basis, that's why the phrase "fine solo" was used. You should learn to differentiate between what is actually typed and what you want to think we said. He is unlike most soloable heroes in that his job is not to hold out and farm but instead to kill the other solo so that early side and ganks pushing advantages can be had.

Sure if you have better solo heroes available they deserve to take it. I've played over 150 games with Kass and all but maybe ten weren't solo, so this is not a case of anecdotal evidence. I just don't want to play him if I'm not solo.

The point is, if you get a fed Kassadin mid (which is very possible from game-to-game) with a good group of pushers and a tank in your team you're set. This makes him an acceptable solo, period.


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Dr Flubstank

Junior Member

02-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick Sand View Post
Let's be real here. You're blowing it out of proportion. No one said he was one of the better solos; it's simply doable on a consistent basis, that's why the phrase "fine solo" was used. You should learn to differentiate between what is actually typed and what you want to think we said. He is unlike most soloable heroes in that his job is not to hold out and farm but instead to kill the other solo so that early side and ganks pushing advantages can be had.

Sure if you have better solo heroes available they deserve to take it. I've played over 150 games with Kass and all but maybe ten weren't solo, so this is not a case of anecdotal evidence. I just don't want to play him if I'm not solo.

The point is, if you get a fed Kassadin mid (which is very possible from game-to-game) with a good group of pushers and a tank in your team you're set. This makes him an acceptable solo, period.
+1 for truth.


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AIM7Sparrow

Senior Member

02-22-2010

lol, you still don't understand, that's fine though. I'll make one last attempt and leave it at that.

Again, he's not a "fine solo" either for reasons already stated. Nothing more I can do to get you to understand that.

And you're telling me his job is to kill the other solo? I'm assuming you meant he specializes in that or is good at since, duh, anyone wants to kill other heroes. If that's the case then that was the most absurd comment you've made because until level 6 he can't do jack **** against the other solo. If you think otherwise you play against terrible solo mids then. Add me and play against my Trist or TF and then tell me your job is to kill me while I'm pushing your tower so hard it's being shoved halfway up your ass.

"I've played over 150 games with Kass and all but maybe ten weren't solo, so this is not a case of anecdotal evidence. I just don't want to play him if I'm not solo. "

Lol, you sir are a very very selfish player then. I never take solo as Kassadin because I can accept the fact he's not good at it/am not so greedy as to only care about getting more exp faster than my teammates.

"The point is, if you get a fed [Inset any champion here] mid (which is very possible from game-to-game) with a good [--group--of--pushers--and--a--tank--in--your--] team you're set. This makes him an acceptable solo, period."

I lol'd at you thinking this supported Kass solo mid.


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kijik

Senior Member

02-22-2010

sigh, I have video proof that kassadin is a very viable mid solo, I'm not saying someone new to kass should ever solo mid, hell I strongly suggest against it in my guide, but I have near 300 games experience with kass, near 2-1 win ratio with him as well, with a near 3-1 KDR at around 3000 kills. I know what I'm talking about, it's rough pre 6, but the point of the mid solo is so they can level quickly and gank, kass with a level advantage dominates incredibly quickly.

livestream.com/kijik

look through those videos, I'm certain there's a video in there of me soloing mid and carrying the game, actually IIRC it's against andy dinh as ashe. one of the last streams as well.

Edit: might I add that a good kassadin will kick the living hell out of TF solo mid? pre 6? sure he has to dance to avoid getting golded, but post 6, the second tf drops his gold card, he dies.


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AIM7Sparrow

Senior Member

02-22-2010

I guess the problem is we're (myself included) are mixing up theoretical vs. experimental. I tend to view things from the theoretical standpoint and I'm steadfast in my opinion that theoretically Kassadin is a terrible solo mid. Just analyzing his characteristics and stats compared to other solos should easily support this. Experimentally though, the human factor becomes evident and I suppose people don't play like perfect robots. If there ever was a character who takes advantage of players not playing to perfection, it was Kassadin, so I can level with you to that point.

Therefore:



Hypothesis: Kassadin is a bad candidate for solo mid.

Conclusion: Results show Kassadin does well as a solo mid champion and this is attributed to experimental errors. (i.e. Non-perfect human play, reaction time, decision-making, etc.)


Does that seem acceptable to you guys?


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kijik

Senior Member

02-22-2010

all I know, is there's only two people I fear solo mid as kass, a good heimer, and atlanta as trist. everyone else either ends up feeding me, or letting me survive and farm to the point where I can go around decimating their team.

I'm not talking experimentally, I'm talking experience. I demand solo mid in near all of my games as ap kass.


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AFKray

Senior Member

02-22-2010

I am simply baffled that people are neglecting the key reason why Null Sphere should be taken over Force Pulse....one silences. If you've ever played against a Fiddle, this wins games. A lot of heroes' can slow/stun or what not, you even have a built in Flash for chasing, but what only 3 or so champions in this game have, is a silence.


Edit: I also agree that Kass can be a viable solo middle. Like Kijik has stated previously, the point of a solo lane is to allow that hero to gain a gold/level advantage compared to 4 members of the other team. This is the primary reason why TF is so desired in the middle lane, his ultimate changes/breaks games. Nidalee is also a prime example. Kass is no exception. Riftwalk allows for amazing ganking potential, another role of the solo-lane. Levels 1-5 is pretty laid back and it's quite easy to sit by your tower and last hit until 6. Personally, the only middle solo I would fear as Kass would be a Trist.