Champion Tiers

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Danziger

Member

01-12-2010

It's pretty interesting seeing how much variation there is in people's own experiences for everything besides god tier, and somewhat for top tier, but there's a few things to keep in mind.

Problem with heroes like Yi is they can be very god tier or very garbage tier solely depending on the lineups. This is a problem when you have blind pick matches...

Many snare based ganker heroes get completely outclassed and shutdown by Yi. They can't push, they can't jungle, and if they're caught they have no way of preventing Yi from owning them. An example is Nunu vs Yi.

Yi matched up against strong stunner or burst damage heroes though, and he is almost unusable.

Personally, I think Yi ruins games. You're either screwed or blessed solely from the luck of the lineup, which you have no control over in a blind pick.

Yi is only god tier in a favorable lineup, and I think is a problem in blind pick because of how much it restricts team hero compositions. Basically he discourages the play of any hero that is "food" for Yi.

Twitch and Shaco however, I would definitely put in God tier. Twitch doesn't even need to be discussed in OPness. His ult destroys teams, and the range on the ult means he can be so far back in the team's line that there's no way anyone would be able to stop him before the whole team is murdered.

Shaco can just control the whole game. He can jungle anywhere, and there is absolutely no risk of doing the enemy jungle because of how easy it is to escape with deceive. He absolutely murders ranged support heroes, which is a core reason so many of the ranged support is just plain unviable.

Also I do not believe trist can be top. She is t4, weak against any team unless she can get fed by noobs.


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zanitonium

Member

01-12-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danziger View Post
Also I do not believe trist can be top. She is t4, weak against any team unless she can get fed by noobs.

I don't think she's weak even when not fed, she has amazing survivability and can put the finishing touches on a gank with her dot as well as position enemy champs into unfavorable positions with her ult. There is more to her than jumping away and pushing enemies away from her tower..


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Morteth

Member

01-12-2010

In MY experience, this game wouldn't be suited for tiers. Why?


From the games that I know (I did not play DotA), tiers are designed for champions that have the same intended playstyle. You cannot place alistar in the same tier list as you would Twitch if you are gauging them purely based on killing potential. Obviously in this game the tiers exist for a larger spectrum of qualifications other than killing potential, mainly the tiers that people have agreed on are based on their competitive effectiveness, ease of use, counter-pickness (doubt thats a word but you get the concept), etc.

I think this game would need a venn diagram of sorts. I have actually started the process of creating the idea of a venn diagram for it. In it, you would put three circles, all overlapping eachother.

In the case where a full LoL Venn Diagram were completely filled, it would show the champions in their corresponding spots but one above the other. For example, as far as DPS goes Shaco would probably be above Master Yi. This of course refers to competitive play, and according to what I have heard Yi's lack of CC is a major downfall to having him appear in any high-level game play. Shaco however, has a fear and a slow, a flash with a built in stealth and a massive crit every 6 seconds or whatever it is. Clearly he has more utility. As a result, Shaco would be placed higher than Yi on the Venn Diagram.

I think that is a better way of gauging certain champions. You can see where they are placed according to their playstyle and their effectiveness in competitive play. The tier thing seems too linear in a perplexing, multi-dimensional game such as this one. Tiers are for SSBB, where everything is made for one person; to kill.

Any opinions on this would be greatly appreciated.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/434...enndiagram.jpg


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The Farkinator

Senior Member

01-12-2010

I really don't understand this. Yi, Shaco, and Twitch have the ability to get roflstomped by any hero in the game, just like... EVERY HERO IN THE GAME. I think the placement of them on such a high tier is simply your way of crying OP while hiding it behind a thorough list of all the championsbut without any actual opinions.


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JunkRamen

Senior Member

01-12-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Farkinator View Post
I really don't understand this. Yi, Shaco, and Twitch have the ability to get roflstomped by any hero in the game, just like... EVERY HERO IN THE GAME. I think the placement of them on such a high tier is simply your way of crying OP while hiding it behind a thorough list of all the championsbut without any actual opinions.
A bad Sagat can get stomped by a good El fuerte, doesn't mean Sagat is anywhere away from top tier or ElF away from low tier in SF4. Skill doesn't remove imbalance. That being said, I strongly disgree with most of the OP's tier list (though Twitch does belong in a tier above everyone else)


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Baron Corm

Senior Member

01-12-2010

Any champion is defeated by chainstunning. Master Yi has better survivability than a whole lot of champions.

I would really, REALLY appreciate it if those of you who strongly disagree with my listing would be more specific, so that I can make it into a good listing, for the benefit of all.


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JunkRamen

Senior Member

01-13-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron Corm View Post
Any champion is defeated by chainstunning. Master Yi has better survivability than a whole lot of champions.
He's significantly worse at dealing with stuns than Twitch, Corki, and Tristana, who all either have better range than most stuns, decent kiting tools, or unload ridiculous amounts of damage before even Moses can target them with a stun. Yi isn't terrible, but he's far from "God tier."


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Baron Corm

Senior Member

01-13-2010

I've never used the phrase "God tier" myself. In its current incarnation, the tier system is simply designed to show which champions can perform their role better than others. Would you agree, at least, that you would rather have Master Yi or Shaco as your melee DPS, than Tryndamere, Warwick, or Jax?


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Charmicarmicarmicat

Senior Member

01-13-2010

Making tier lists is very hard. Your list in inaccurate, but there are some champions that just don't work well against specific lineups, but completely stomp others(example: Yi) then there are heroes that are universally useful against anything but not particularly exceptional against others (example: CM)

How do you class those?


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Baron Corm

Senior Member

01-13-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charmicarmicarmicat View Post
Making tier lists is very hard. Your list in inaccurate, but there are some champions that just don't work well against specific lineups, but completely stomp others(example: Yi) then there are heroes that are universally useful against anything but not particularly exceptional against others (example: CM)

How do you class those?
I think it's somewhat like taking an "average". How many lineups is the champion good against. I just saw you place Yi in mid tier in another thread so I think you somewhat understand what I'm taking about. I'm just trying to get a rough list out.