Unkillable pushing team: Please try before objecting

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Kamitsu

Member

12-18-2009

guys, you have my thanks for all the constructive criticism, but please read the page for my thoughts on executioner's...everyone seems to think that these heroes can ONLY heal!


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Kamitsu

Member

12-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Majix View Post
This made my day.

Your team does sound pretty good though, I've been up against a Taric alone who could take insane damage from my team and still be able to push through it all. The team would obviously have a weakness to really high ranged DPS, but overall this team could probably harass pretty effectively.
I like the fact that you understand that this team isn't reduced to only healing - healing only makes this team better. All the characters on this team (except Soraka) have a slow/stun.


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Solus

Senior Member

12-18-2009

Katarina, Twitch, Gangplank, Blitzcrank, Janna, Kassadin, Sivir and a few others I can't think of right off the top of my head can make your day very, very frustrating. Sivir with a starks and a couple carries would absolutely wreck your team. Janna, soraka and Taric would both go down very hard if focused on by even 2 carries with Sivir's ult going.

I'm also a very strong believer in Janna with flash. Being able to flash into the middle of an entire group of enemies and launching them to the far corners of the map is the perfect level of chaos to get at least a kill or two. Yes I know your build is for pushing, but pushes go far more easier with the enemy team rattled.

It's been said, heal isn't something you really need to stack. I'd take heal off of Taric and Janna at least and give them Rally/Flash respectively.


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Kamitsu

Member

12-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solus View Post
Katarina, Twitch, Gangplank, Blitzcrank, Janna, Kassadin, Sivir and a few others I can't think of right off the top of my head can make your day very, very frustrating. Sivir with a starks and a couple carries would absolutely wreck your team. Janna, soraka and Taric would both go down very hard if focused on by even 2 carries with Sivir's ult going.

I'm also a very strong believer in Janna with flash. Being able to flash into the middle of an entire group of enemies and launching them to the far corners of the map is the perfect level of chaos to get at least a kill or two. Yes I know your build is for pushing, but pushes go far more easier with the enemy team rattled.

It's been said, heal isn't something you really need to stack. I'd take heal off of Taric and Janna at least and give them Rally/Flash respectively.
Solus, you might be on to something. Coupled with Kayle's ult, Janna could step in unharmed...You might be right.


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Rudeboymike

Senior Member

12-18-2009

Why would you deviate from the typical unkillable team? You know the tried and true 4 Tank + Soraka team?

Amumu
Nunu
Blitz
Malphite
Soraka

Everyone stack Aegis + Armor. Tower diving and tower tanking. You can't die, monstrous AOE, chasing, harassing, and single target damage. Its played by laning till 6 or 7. Everyone moves in a pack, push a tower.. force a team battle. Pull one if you can to start, if not Malphite initiates with ult. Mummy Ult, then Nunu Ult, then Blitz Ult. Chase everyone down regardless of what towers are up. Get an Ace, push two towers.

This IS the best tank team (probably best team comp altogether imo).


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Kamitsu

Member

12-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudeboymike View Post
Why would you deviate from the typical unkillable team? You know the tried and true 4 Tank + Soraka team?

Amumu
Nunu
Blitz
Malphite
Soraka

Everyone stack Aegis + Armor. Tower diving and tower tanking. You can't die, monstrous AOE, chasing, harassing, and single target damage. Its played by laning till 6 or 7. Everyone moves in a pack, push a tower.. force a team battle. Pull one if you can to start, if not Malphite initiates with ult. Mummy Ult, then Nunu Ult, then Blitz Ult. Chase everyone down regardless of what towers are up. Get an Ace, push two towers.

This IS the best tank team (probably best team comp altogether imo).
Mike, the details are vague, but I could see how this would work. I'll give it a try and maybe put up a guide after awhile - thanks for the tip.


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Edwin the Scribe

Junior Member

12-18-2009

In a nutshell, no.

This team simply doesn't have the damage to put up a fight given a 5v5. 5x clairvoyance is foolish, as is 5x heal.

The reduction in heal effectiveness means that only 1-2 will ever go off. Heal simply isn't that great. The fallacy here is that more health = victory. You shouldn't need 5 clairvoyance in a team fight, because it should be over very quickly. For instance, if you find yourself against a team with decent DPS, like a Tryndamere, and good CC, like a Fiddlesticks or a Nunu/Mummy (Ults), you can very quickly all be CC'd, while the DPS drops your Janna/Soroka (squishy). Cleanse is your bane here, as would be exhaust. Effective CC and focus fire from superior DPS has someone dead long before you can heal them.

Then you're stuck 4v5 with absolutely no carries. Not good.


Deprecating returns from heal makes the five stack completely useless, while an AOE character with executioners calling would be a nightmare.

Consider a Warwick with lifesteal- could you even kill him?

You need to CC crowds while focusing fire. You are assuming fights last a long time. They don't.


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Rudeboymike

Senior Member

12-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamitsu View Post
Mike, the details are vague, but I could see how this would work. I'll give it a try and maybe put up a guide after awhile - thanks for the tip.
Yea, sorry for the lack of details, but it doesn't require much skill or work. Just have everyone know their character and role. And convince someone to play the boring Soraka role, generally whoever is the most subpar player (we all have the IRL bad friend that wants to play).

Have soraka just healbot away while everyone else mows down champions and towers. The only counter to it is many physical DPS carries that need to farm and be fed with Armor Pen. Multiple fed carries on the other team is rare, unless yall are bad.


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Kamitsu

Member

12-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwin the Scribe View Post
In a nutshell, no.

This team simply doesn't have the damage to put up a fight given a 5v5. 5x clairvoyance is foolish, as is 5x heal.

The reduction in heal effectiveness means that only 1-2 will ever go off. Heal simply isn't that great. The fallacy here is that more health = victory. You shouldn't need 5 clairvoyance in a team fight, because it should be over very quickly. For instance, if you find yourself against a team with decent DPS, like a Tryndamere, and good CC, like a Fiddlesticks or a Nunu/Mummy (Ults), you can very quickly all be CC'd, while the DPS drops your Janna/Soroka (squishy). Cleanse is your bane here, as would be exhaust. Effective CC and focus fire from superior DPS has someone dead long before you can heal them.

Then you're stuck 4v5 with absolutely no carries. Not good.


Deprecating returns from heal makes the five stack completely useless, while an AOE character with executioners calling would be a nightmare.

Consider a Warwick with lifesteal- could you even kill him?

You need to CC crowds while focusing fire. You are assuming fights last a long time. They don't.
I don't think you read the page, you're just saying things without trying it out.
Sorry Edwin, you just don't take the strengths of each member of this team into consideration. All things you have spoken of can be countered by silence. If things get dicey, you can use heal. If they are more dicey, you have Janna's ult, and Kayle's if someone is being focused. You say fights are quick - not against this team. They will outlast you in both mana and health, and what do you do then?
Don't forget headbutt, pulverize, and dazzle. Tornado will stop you in your tracks, too. Fiddle is a valid argument, however. Then again, what team DOESN'T fiddle pose a problem for?

Also, you mean clarity, not clairvoyance.


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Kamitsu

Member

01-04-2010

Mastery tree is now up on leaguecraft, so have a gander at the one I put up for this team. Thanks!


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