@riot: how hard should a carry carry?

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Palette Town

Senior Member

12-09-2009

also, this game is much more forgiving towards carries.

you can't take away their gold.

even if they don't get any ganks, they can make up what they lose by killing what, 5-6 creeps?


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ZGBudai

Member

12-09-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Palette Town View Post
you could actually make it so that ap characters did actual damage late game rather than just be there for stuns.

it's ridiculous how all it takes to stop anivia's ult dead in its tracks is 100 or so mr.

the current deathfire grasp is awful and seeing how carries can stack hp like nobody's business, it would be really nice to have a madred's equivalent for casters. who gives a **** about veigar doing 1000 damage when carries are up to 3k? carries become really strong starting midgame (even if you prevent them from ganking) and by late game, whether your win or lose depends almost entirely on:
1. how many carries your team has
2. what the carries are (eg. trynd + yi)
Wait, Deathfire Grasp is awful?

When was this?!


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DT777

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Senior Member

12-09-2009

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Originally Posted by ZGBudai View Post
1) "Don't let that character farm x amount of gold or you deserve to lose"
2) Get some armor
3) Use the SUMMONER spell Exhaust
4) CC is your best friend
5) It's a carry? They are supposed to be uber strong in the late-game.
Alright, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that the first line is complete and utter bull.

The second is easily countered, unless you have like 800 armor *cough*rammus*cough*

The second two are countered by cleanse. As well they should be. This is supposed to be a game. You are supposed to play it. Not sit and watch your team die from chain aoe stun because you can't do anything. CC/stun are unfun mechanics.

Which brings me into number 5: Why is it the mentality that carries should be uber strong? Stronger, perhaps, because of the slower going late game, but they shouldn't outclass non-carries to the point of "if I farm x gold, we win." So why is it that carries need to be so abnormally powerful (tryn, yi, corki, ashe) that CC over load becomes a necessary mechanic in the game to balance them out? That's like compensating for one unfun mechanic with another. It's stupid and asinine.


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Palette Town

Senior Member

12-09-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZGBudai View Post
Wait, Deathfire Grasp is awful?

When was this?!
you know you'd choose the old mejais over the current deathgrasp if you could.


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Palette Town

Senior Member

12-09-2009

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Originally Posted by DT777 View Post
Alright, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that the first line is complete and utter bull.

The second is easily countered, unless you have like 800 armor *cough*rammus*cough*

The second two are countered by cleanse. As well they should be. This is supposed to be a game. You are supposed to play it. Not sit and watch your team die from chain aoe stun because you can't do anything. CC/stun are unfun mechanics.

Which brings me into number 5: Why is it the mentality that carries should be uber strong? Stronger, perhaps, because of the slower going late game, but they shouldn't outclass non-carries to the point of "if I farm x gold, we win." So why is it that carries need to be so abnormally powerful (tryn, yi, corki, ashe) that CC over load becomes a necessary mechanic in the game to balance them out? That's like compensating for one unfun mechanic with another. It's stupid and asinine.
so you're saying rammus is a staple in every game?

unless you're rammus, carries are free to choose whoever they want as their target. that screams imbalance


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Drggg

Senior Member

12-09-2009

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Originally Posted by Palette Town View Post
also, this game is much more forgiving towards carries.

you can't take away their gold.

even if they don't get any ganks, they can make up what they lose by killing what, 5-6 creeps?
Totally agree with this. Ganking a carry does not set them back like it did in dota. In DOTA if specter started out 0-3 his recovery was a rough road. I don't think trynd has the same rough road ahead of him.

This could also be a function of items feeling relatively cheaper ( to purchase) then DOTA


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Neltharek

Junior Member

12-09-2009

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Originally Posted by Atlanta View Post
There is plenty of downside to being Yi or Trynd against a team comp with multiple CC's or blind. Oh wait... cleanse.
^ this times a million. Cleanse has broken any hope of taking down carries before they rape your team out of existence. It's become bring the most carries to win.


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DT777

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Senior Member

12-09-2009

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Originally Posted by Palette Town View Post
so you're saying rammus is a staple in every game?

unless you're rammus, carries are free to choose whoever they want as their target. that screams imbalance
Exactly. It's almost impossible to play a tank if a carry manages to pick up last whisper + black cleaver. Not only do both items increase damage out put heavily, they both shred armor.

Also, rammus should be a staple. 4s uncleanseable taunt. With a short cd. Oh, and it silences you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neltharek View Post
^ this times a million. Cleanse has broken any hope of taking down carries before they rape your team out of existence. It's become bring the most carries to win.
The solution to this problem isn't nerfing cleanse or buffing cc. It's toning down carries.


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IS138d309a4fea569e777b5

Senior Member

12-09-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by DT777 View Post
Alright, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that the first line is complete and utter bull.

The second is easily countered, unless you have like 800 armor *cough*rammus*cough*

The second two are countered by cleanse. As well they should be. This is supposed to be a game. You are supposed to play it. Not sit and watch your team die from chain aoe stun because you can't do anything. CC/stun are unfun mechanics.

Which brings me into number 5: Why is it the mentality that carries should be uber strong? Stronger, perhaps, because of the slower going late game, but they shouldn't outclass non-carries to the point of "if I farm x gold, we win." So why is it that carries need to be so abnormally powerful (tryn, yi, corki, ashe) that CC over load becomes a necessary mechanic in the game to balance them out? That's like compensating for one unfun mechanic with another. It's stupid and asinine.
you just hate Yi because you play Singed and highlander makes him immune to poison for some reason, right?

(dont worry i feel the same way)


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DT777

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Senior Member

12-09-2009

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Originally Posted by MCHeimer View Post
you just hate Yi because you play Singed and highlander makes him immune to poison for some reason, right?

(dont worry i feel the same way)
zzz yi is a ***** that I kite and farm.