Just Started Playing Ranked

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MEMEME670

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Senior Member

04-03-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xin it to Win It View Post
The problem with that logic is that the support on the team you are matched against is dealing with the same randomness that you are. One way of handling this situation is to make friends and duo queue. The issue you will see with that is when your teammates ware interested in either the support or the add role and you need to negotiate in the pre-game lobby.
Yeah, the enemy support is most definitely reliant on his adc also. I don't think this is a flaw in my logic, it's just a logical conclusion, it doesn't point out any flaws in it.

I question the reliability of a system that attempts to calculate the solo skill of one person, and yet requires me to queue with someone else. If this is required, how reliable is the system?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xin it to Win It View Post
Another way of handling this comes down to champion selection. Right now I am having much better luck with Sona that I did with Leona. I believe this is because I can play far more passive with Sona. Even if my lane phase is just reduce the number of times my adc dies, I can still make a big impact in team fights.
Yes, it is most definitely possible to make an impact outside of lane phase, but this is still a minimal impact on the game relative to the impact the other 4 people will have had. However, I can't find any major flaws with what you're saying, so it seems in general like it would work. Doesn't really solve the problem I was talking about, but does help to mitigate it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zolarion Strife View Post
Isn't this the point of a support player? You support the team. There's plenty of ways to do this: Pick a tanky, initiator support (alistar, taric, leona) and take advantage of poor enemy positioning. Pick a damage-dealing support (zyra, lux, nidalee) and build into more of a carry role. Pick a disruption/keep-others-alive support (sona, lulu, nami) to allow your teammates to deal more damage than the enemy.
Yes, but the first 10-20 minutes of the game have you reliant on someone else. In fact, for that time your whole job is to help them do good, so when they don't do good, that whole time period is wasted and you may very well have not been playing the game, because you won't have done much.

They can do badly because you do badly, or do badly because they do. The latter is far more common, unfortunately.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zolarion Strife View Post
If I'm supporting and I've found that my ad carry is lackluster but my akali mid is doing well, then I will try to keep her alive more. Additionally, if you feel you are engaging and your adc is not following up, you can always communicate with him/her to make it go better. "I'll ping when I'm going to stun and go in, you follow up." If you need to switch targets in a lane fight, again, make use of pings and you make these decisions if you feel your adc shouldn't.
I don't want to just dismiss you, but I'm not sure what else I can do here. I definitely use pings and communication (when possible). I may not use them every single time they could help, but I definitely use them a lot. And I find even so, I can't ping the ADC to farm well. There isn't much I can do other then tell the ADC to move up when we should be aggressive, and sometimes they don't.

And when they don't? Welp, guess I don't get to play the game until after lane phase.

And is that really a sentence I should ever be able to logically say in a game that tries to rank my skill?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zolarion Strife View Post
I'm also in silver and I've found that I've been able to have the most impact on games as a support player (I usually play nami) because I focus on keeping teammates alive and disrupting the enemy, usually to a greater degree of success than the enemy support regardless of whether I'm ahead or behind.
I can't say much here because things are flat out different in platinum. Nami is horrible here, and supports know to get aegis ASAP, which makes mostly any support have a large impact on a teamfight, emphasizing whoever is ahead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dumyr View Post
I say it's a perception problem because when you've played 20 total games, if your expected win rate is 55% (you're so much better than average at your position that you elevate your team's chance of victory to 55%, all else being equal), and you happen to just get unlucky, you could still be 9-11 or 10-10 pretty easily, and 7-13 isn't that far of an outlier. It feels like the system is broken, and it feels like you aren't having an effect on the game. But the truth is, if you really are better than average at your role each game, your expected win rate really is above 50%, and even if you have a run of 15 or 20 games that go against the odds, reversion to the mean kicks in eventually. If you play enough games, you will go up in rating. Enough games might mean 150 or 200, but still.
Firstly, a great ADC with a bad support isn't that bad off. They still win in farm, and come out of the lane phase ahead.

Secondly, I can see what you're saying, but my expected win rate is still lower than if say, a mid player was as good at mid as I was at support. The best way to explain this is to assume that if you rate ADC/Support on a scale of 1-10, and then add them together, whichever lane has the higher number will generally win.

Even if my skill level is 7/10 (30th percentile), on average our lanes rating will be 12/20 (40th percentile).

So, even assuming support had exactly equal influence on the lane as the ADC, I'm still going to be pulled down on average, making my chance of winning the lane less than if I was in a solo lane or the jungle(jungle is kinda variable too).

That's what I'm saying (Although it may not have been initially clear, I apologize.), that my skill level isn't accurately reflected because even when other roles escape variance, I am still influenced in it, my expected win rate being so influenced by another random factor.


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Hi Geoffrey

aka Bazner

Follow Xin it to Win It on Twitter

04-06-2013
111 of 123 Riot Posts

I am now convinced that this whole support thing is real, it just takes the right support.

I have never had this much success in Ranked or Normal play with any method. Until I start losing, I am a believer.


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PhantomBanana

Senior Member

04-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xin it to Win It View Post
I am now convinced that this whole support thing is real, it just takes the right support.

I have never had this much success in Ranked or Normal play with any method. Until I start losing, I am a believer.
Well done!! Hope you can keep it up, I really hit my stride with support as well.


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Seeker0fTruth

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Senior Member

04-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xin it to Win It View Post
I am now convinced that this whole support thing is real, it just takes the right support.

I have never had this much success in Ranked or Normal play with any method. Until I start losing, I am a believer.

I know what you mean. I was a jungler, but I grew frustrated. I was stuck at silver 1. There were never any wards, my ad carry always fed (and it has become VERY difficult to gank bot lane with sightstone), no one ever peeled for the ad carry . . . I decided that, as an experiment, I'd try supporting. The difference was night and day. In 17 games (two of them as jungle) I won 15. 15 of those games, I played support thresh and I moved STRAIGHT to gold 5, playing against Diamonds and Plats in some of my qualifier matches. It's for real.


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YSRS

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Senior Member

04-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xin it to Win It View Post
I am now convinced that this whole support thing is real, it just takes the right support.

I have never had this much success in Ranked or Normal play with any method. Until I start losing, I am a believer.
Congrads! I remember one of the matches I duo'd with you and you certainly played like a
Gold 5/Silver 1 support!

If ya ever feel like trying our support at Gold 5 ( i got promoted ^_^ )

I'd be happy to duo up and send Sona into gold lv fights! (prehaps bursting through the silver regions? ) ^_^


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Hi Geoffrey

aka Bazner

Follow Xin it to Win It on Twitter

04-06-2013
112 of 123 Riot Posts

The pressure!!!


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The Black Okami

Senior Member

04-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xin it to Win It View Post
The pressure!!!
Spooky start, good luck!


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Numot

Senior Member

04-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xin it to Win It View Post
I set a goal of playing until I had at least 100 ranked wins in season 3. Last night I hit my goal and sit at 102 wins and 96 losses. Time for a new goal, Silver V by the end of the season.
If you ever want to duo que I am always up for one when I am on. Seem to always have better luck as a duo que. Have only played 26 ranked games this season. Unfortantly 11/15 so far. After coming out of my placement matchs(had really bad luck, going 2/8) I was placed Bronze 5. In then went on to win 5 games straight and get promoted to Bronze 4 while still a recruit in bronze 5. Then my luck changed back and I got a few losses varrying for outplayed, which I don't mind, to afks and people that did not seem to have the basics yet and when they dided once just kept dieing, never learning. Only won my first game at bronze 4, then lost back to bronze 5, and then lost 2 more before being able to win again.


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Comedian

Senior Member

04-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xin it to Win It View Post
The pressure!!!
How did it go?


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DEN15 512goesMOO

Senior Member

04-06-2013

I wish I could rank up somewhere, anywhere, but I will probably be stuck in Bronze IV for life.