@ Grumpy Monkey and Morello, please talk to Trundle VU opponents.

First Riot Post
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IronStylus

Sr. Concept Artist

04-04-2013
1 of 2 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by woopyfrood View Post
The forums have been broiling with argument on all sides over this issue, and through it all I have seen pages upon pages of heartfelt reasoning against the Trundle VU as it currently stands.

During the teaser, Grumpy said to withhold judgement until we had more information. We have that now, but constructive criticism is not being responded to. Support has been met with thanks, anger has been met with dismissal, but I have not seen any Rioter respond to an in-depth criticism of the VU.

I realize it is possible that Riot is contemplating how to handle this derision in the community. Still, If Grumpy or Morello would be kind enough as to grant this thread an audience, I could find many posts that could illustrate the problems with this Visual Update much more eloquently than I, and I'm sure many others would chime in as well.
This isn't going to be much of a consolation because I'm really, really dead tired. A lot of people have just returned from PAX, GDC, and other functions. Dust is still settling. I've been on the forums for the past 2 weeks looking at feedback. So has Grumpy Monkey, so have a lot of people.

Nothing is being ignored.

Believe me. We honestly take a lot of it too personally quite honestly. When people tell GM that he's ripped the heart and soul out of their most beloved of characters and they're going to turn away from the game from feeling so emotionally destroyed.. well.. that's a little rough to lay on the shoulders of one guy. But whatever, we honestly are more than happy to listen and act where we can.

We're looking at all the feedback that's coming in, we're having meetings, doing the usual stuff. We're most likely going to do some sort of continued messaging talking about our process, explaining our intentions and decisions, and generally reaching out to the community to further clarify what's going through our brains.

I'm not certain what will be able to be achieved in terms of any content changing at this point in relation to the torrent of feedback currently hitting our shores. I'm at the very beginning of a process that goes on for months. I'm not going to offer any guarantees of anything. But I can assure you that no one is blind or deaf to the feedback coming in, but there's certainly no way for us to respond to every thread, in every territory, as things are emerging minute to minute. Please realize we're still guys with a day-to-day, we're still doing a lot more than you're privy to, but we assimilate everything. However, as craftsmen, as people who do have products to deliver, it's part of our job to listen to everything, but act on what we feel is the best course. Feedback must be analyzed, weighed, and selectively integrated. We can only do this so fast, based on what we feel is best from our particular angle of understanding.

We'll continue to meet and discuss how this is playing out and what actions will be taken either now or in the future. I'm not going to give any assessment, or make any conjectures, I just want to pop in, say that we're not licking up positive feedback and ignoring what's critical. It's impossible for us to do that. We're far to sensitive to not feel the vibe that's in the community, however, it's a lot of passionate feedback, at a single time, in large doses. That's a lot for anyone to effectively process in a short period of time.

Bear with us. We're just dudes trying to make some cool stuff. We're doing the best we can.


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Sexploits

Senior Member

04-04-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Bear with us. We're just dudes trying to make some cool stuff. We're doing the best we can.
<3

Get some rest, man.


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Echous

Senior Member

04-04-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
This isn't going to be much of a consolation because I'm really, really dead tired. A lot of people have just returned from PAX, GDC, and other functions. Dust is still settling. I've been on the forums for the past 2 weeks looking at feedback. So has Grumpy Monkey, so have a lot of people.

Nothing is being ignored.

Believe me. We honestly take a lot of it too personally quite honestly. When people tell GM that he's ripped the heart and soul out of their most beloved of characters and they're going to turn away from the game from feeling so emotionally destroyed.. well.. that's a little rough to lay on the shoulders of one guy. But whatever, we honestly are more than happy to listen and act where we can.

We're looking at all the feedback that's coming in, we're having meetings, doing the usual stuff. We're most likely going to do some sort of continued messaging talking about our process, explaining our intentions and decisions, and generally reaching out to the community to further clarify what's going through our brains.

I'm not certain what will be able to be achieved in terms of any content changing at this point in relation to the torrent of feedback currently hitting our shores. I'm at the very beginning of a process that goes on for months. I'm not going to offer any guarantees of anything. But I can assure you that no one is blind or deaf to the feedback coming in, but there's certainly no way for us to respond to every thread, in every territory, as things are emerging minute to minute. Please realize we're still guys with a day-to-day, we're still doing a lot more than you're privy to, but we assimilate everything. However, as craftsmen, as people who do have products to deliver, it's part of our job to listen to everything, but act on what we feel is the best course. Feedback must be analyzed, weighed, and selectively integrated. We can only do this so fast, based on what we feel is best from our particular angle of understanding.

We'll continue to meet and discuss how this is playing out and what actions will be taken either now or in the future. I'm not going to give any assessment, or make any conjectures, I just want to pop in, say that we're not licking up positive feedback and ignoring what's critical. It's impossible for us to do that. We're far to sensitive to not feel the vibe that's in the community, however, it's a lot of passionate feedback, at a single time, in large doses. That's a lot for anyone to effectively process in a short period of time.

Bear with us. We're just dudes trying to make some cool stuff. We're doing the best we can.
I have a love/hate relationship with you, firstly you do things like this, answer the people and try your best to give what information you can to any type of situation, then you let them put a damned Teemo on my Sunbathing Leona! NO bad birdy don't let them put that rat on such a radiant and strong womans surf board(shield), otherwise I will be force to drop a 747 sized Leona shield on your car.

P.S. MAKE THAT SKIN HAPPEN SHE IS MY FAVORITE CHAMPION!!!


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IronStylus

Sr. Concept Artist

04-04-2013
2 of 2 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echous View Post
I have a love/hate relationship with you, firstly you do things like this, answer the people and try your best to give what information you can to any type of situation, then you let them put a damned Teemo on my Sunbathing Leona! NO bad birdy don't let them put that rat on such a radiant and strong womans surf board(shield), otherwise I will be force to drop a 747 sized Leona shield on your car.

P.S. MAKE THAT SKIN HAPPEN SHE IS MY FAVORITE CHAMPION!!!
I can say with 99% certainty that there will be no Teemo on that surfboard


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DrTemptragon

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Senior Member

04-04-2013

Grumpy Monkey is a craftsman whose work basically demands my highest respect. The guy's a genius and I don't blame him in the slightest for Trundle's changes. He wasn't in control of the art direction.

The Lore, on the other hand... What they've done is not good. While the soul of Trundle is still in there, I think most people fell in love with the story first. I know I did. We still have our tricksy troll whose physically inferior to, but holds power over, his peers and tribe. But the self-sacrifice and resilience in his story is gone and we miss it dearly.

I just wonder what would happen if Jayce's original Lore came out now. Frankly, if that hadn't been changed, I would've quit.


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Torchide

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Member

04-04-2013

The same thing happened with Karma. We were given so much reassurance, deceived into believing Riot truly cared about our opinions, only to have all of that thrown out the door in an instant.

I'm not even talking about her kit. I rarely play anymore, due to a combination of time and recent disappointment in the company. I'm still talking about her lore, which, I believe is the same issue we are having here due to the lack of Trundle's kit changes. Trundle fans, consider yourselves lucky.

I suppose I have Riot to thank for her unpopular kit which has caused fans against the rework to no longer be a minority. Being a minority was the excuse they used to completely ignore our input. The way I see it, before the change, the majority didn't care either way while the minority was strongly against.


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Thorthedark

Senior Member

04-04-2013

Very understandable. The way I look at it is...say you took Anivia and said "well, Cryopheonix is a silly concept so instead we made her into a wooly mammoth. Same spells, but we gave her a deep voice and changed her lore."

That being said, the fact that you are leaving the original voice/personality in the "Traditional Trundle" skin is more than I could have hoped for. And I want to thank you for that. For those of us who want "our trundle" you left us the option. No other game company would have done that.


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Lethminite

Senior Member

04-04-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
This isn't going to be much of a consolation because I'm really, really dead tired. A lot of people have just returned from PAX, GDC, and other functions. Dust is still settling. I've been on the forums for the past 2 weeks looking at feedback. So has Grumpy Monkey, so have a lot of people.

Nothing is being ignored.

Believe me. We honestly take a lot of it too personally quite honestly. When people tell GM that he's ripped the heart and soul out of their most beloved of characters and they're going to turn away from the game from feeling so emotionally destroyed.. well.. that's a little rough to lay on the shoulders of one guy. But whatever, we honestly are more than happy to listen and act where we can.

We're looking at all the feedback that's coming in, we're having meetings, doing the usual stuff. We're most likely going to do some sort of continued messaging talking about our process, explaining our intentions and decisions, and generally reaching out to the community to further clarify what's going through our brains.

I'm not certain what will be able to be achieved in terms of any content changing at this point in relation to the torrent of feedback currently hitting our shores. I'm at the very beginning of a process that goes on for months. I'm not going to offer any guarantees of anything. But I can assure you that no one is blind or deaf to the feedback coming in, but there's certainly no way for us to respond to every thread, in every territory, as things are emerging minute to minute. Please realize we're still guys with a day-to-day, we're still doing a lot more than you're privy to, but we assimilate everything. However, as craftsmen, as people who do have products to deliver, it's part of our job to listen to everything, but act on what we feel is the best course. Feedback must be analyzed, weighed, and selectively integrated. We can only do this so fast, based on what we feel is best from our particular angle of understanding.

We'll continue to meet and discuss how this is playing out and what actions will be taken either now or in the future. I'm not going to give any assessment, or make any conjectures, I just want to pop in, say that we're not licking up positive feedback and ignoring what's critical. It's impossible for us to do that. We're far to sensitive to not feel the vibe that's in the community, however, it's a lot of passionate feedback, at a single time, in large doses. That's a lot for anyone to effectively process in a short period of time.

Bear with us. We're just dudes trying to make some cool stuff. We're doing the best we can.
Thank you so much, just haveing that little recognition is enough for now.

I really don't think this will be super difficult to fix unless you really are planning mass retcons to every champion that doesn't fit on a broader scale.

I really hope we can either get a jayce like fix so it really is trundle, or a rename +anivia-like chat name change when using the traditional skin making them different characters.

I know this one would be contested, but i'd honestly be happy if you just took a stance like you did with eve's stealth saying "No, we don't want old trundle" and changed his name leaving trundle as dead.

I just think retcons are a very bad way of fixing up lore problems.


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ColdJr

Senior Member

04-04-2013

i really, REALLY hope riot doesnt cave in to the gd whine and revert what they're doing with trundle.


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Splinterheart

Senior Member

04-04-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
I can say with 99% certainty that there will be no Teemo on that surfboard
Gooooood- Wait. Will there be a Teemo elsewhere?! O_O