These Riot posts telling people to ignore pick order are doing massive harm.

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UnknownRandom

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Griftrix View Post
How well do you think someone who claims to be terrible at support will do at support? Do you really want to have that person playing their worst role?

Let me give an example for those who want a structured system.

Person 1 and 2 call mid. Here is the right thing to do. Ask each other what other roles they are good at. Decide together which one should play mid, considering team composition and counter picking. If one of the players states a role that has not yet been filled as a secondary role they are good at, then this becomes easy.
We can't know the ins and outs of every person who comes into solo que with us. What I do know, is that I'm 4 picks ahead of the guy who is screaming 'TOP OR AFK', yet because he is unwilling to compromise, I am forced to acquiesce my best role on the chance that someone might, or might not be better at it than I am?

A statement needs to be made:

When team members are unwilling to compromise, to avoid "being a jerk", desired role selection ultimately falls upon "PICK ORDER". Not who can CTRL+V fastest


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Xanthalis

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Griftrix View Post
How well do you think someone who claims to be terrible at support will do at support? Do you really want to have that person playing their worst role?

Let me give an example for those who want a structured system.

Person 1 and 2 call mid. Here is the right thing to do. Ask each other what other roles they are good at. Decide together which one should play mid, considering team composition and counter picking. If one of the players states a role that has not yet been filled as a secondary role they are good at, then this becomes easy.
You're making way too many assumptions about the general maturity level and rationality of the majority of solo queue players.

Not only that, but all this does is allow some to say "I'm bad at <insert role>" and use it to justify never having to play that role, whether it's true or not. Support is probably the most common example here.


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30 Helens

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elgreezy View Post
Sometimes I have a hard time believing you guys are playing the same game we are.
I assume their experience is vastly different than ours. No one wants to be the guy trolling in a game with a Riot employee.


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Grigorian Tutor

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nbur View Post
seriously fuking hate you GD

this gets postedby every newb to ever step foot in ranked and you rip them apart. Someone on the top suggests in and you want it in the game instantly ..

seriously GD go be sheep at blizzard, its where you came from, go back home.

Dont get me wrong i have supported this from day one when i summon picked my a jungle champ and smite when i had locked in 2 picks prior to them and talking in chat... But i have seen this suggestion 200 times on these boards only to watch the OP eatten alive quoting reds about pick order is nothing and dont be a jerk and l2p ... so much hate right now.
You are the GD, Just like every noob in elo hell is a part of elo hell in his own right, and how do you think it comes off saying retarded things like this. Did it ever occur to you that the OP isnt here everyday reading the forums or that pushing an issue further is a step in the right direction


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Akuni

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Stop twisting every post to something that you can scream on.

They did NEVER say ignore pick order, play what you like and go yolo. In fact the message was "Calling is no pick-right and pick order doesn't mean anything aswell - A good team will SPEAK and plan together so everyone get's the most comfortable position out of it"

Example:
Entering champ select...
Ally 1: hi, pref top or mid (+additional lanes)
Ally 2: sup, i pref adc but i could also top (+additional lanes)
Ally 3: yo, i like top or adc (+additional lanes)
Ally 4: Hi, I pref mid or jungle (+additional lanes)
Me: aloha, pref mid or sup (Yeah that's true, i main sup - deal with it) but I can fare top or jungle too
We discuss who takes which lane/Who can fit which role the best.
We get into a game with a role which we like and with a basic strategy set up.
We stay positive and play a good game.
We usually end up winning that game.

See above, we "called preferences" but we didn't persist on them - We discussed, ignoring the pick order, who would fit the role in the best way and we got into a game without being stressed from pre-game chat already.

THIS is how it should go and THIS is what Griftrix has tried to explain. I'm sorry if you still have to hate on him for being a curious Riot employee who tries to get a discussion rolling (Yeah he might not give you an answer but he gives you questions to think about - questions which can lead to discovering the answer to your question).

Stop being so immature. You rock Griftrix. And I can say that without knowing you as I actually take my time READING and THINKING about your posts. Thanks for never giving up. (Oh and tell Xyph, meddler, Volty and Stylus thank you forthe champs they did as I love those <3)

Cheers
A EUW summoner fed up by those hater posts

Edit: Inbefore someone pulls the bronze/silver league card again - The majority of players is just that: bronze and silver. Deal with it and be happy if you're more, statistically you have no right to look down on a bronze player and that's comming from a gold player who keeps up with platin friends.

Edit 2: Just noticed the op's name - Who would have guessed...


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Nbur

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grigorian Tutor View Post
You are the GD, Just like every noob in elo hell is a part of elo hell in his own right, and how do you think it comes off saying retarded things like this. Did it ever occur to you that the OP isnt here everyday reading the forums or that pushing an issue further is a step in the right direction
do you read?

do you know who the OP is?


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Zerglinator

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by 30 Helens View Post
You call it faith while those of us with experience in lower brackets call it naivety. And before you talk about how you started in bronze and your faith was rewarded, I point you to the big fat "Riot" in front of your summoner name.
Griftrix does not have Riot in front of his summoner name. He's been over this.

Also, I find it kind of naive that people think that Riot saying "Pick order>call order" or "Call order>pick order" will somehow make people stop arguing about it.


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Tbird

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Here is why there shouldn't be a rule either way...

Take my specific case...I am under no delusions that I am a great player. I feel that I probably belong somewhere in the mid of Silver tier but as I went on a losing streak before placement in the preseason I ended up in Bronze I. Now I feel that I can play at a higher level if I play as an adc or sup and maybe even mid. If you asked me to place myself as a top laner or jungler, however, I would say I'm prob more like Bronze III. So what do we do in my situation?

Do I just take the role I get and hope for the best or do I vocalize that I am bad at top and jung. That's why there just cannot be a hard and fast rule about call or pick order. NO ONE wants me playing top or jung and that is the point I am trying to get across. Maybe you are better than me at every role but if you want adc and you're only a little better than me but at jungle you are a lot better than me than the team as a whole would benefit from me being adc and you jungling.


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Lost My Blades

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Griftrix View Post
How well do you think someone who claims to be terrible at support will do at support? Do you really want to have that person playing their worst role?

Let me give an example for those who want a structured system.

Person 1 and 2 call mid. Here is the right thing to do. Ask each other what other roles they are good at. Decide together which one should play mid, considering team composition and counter picking. If one of the players states a role that has not yet been filled as a secondary role they are good at, then this becomes easy.
Here is an idea i have been thinking about that could help with champion select communication. What if when you queue you select the 2 roles you wold prefer and then were matched with other people to fill the other roles. Then in champion select you had a symbol or something signaling the roles you you queued up for? Like the way some MMO's do dungeon queues like in Rift for example.


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ThanksALatte

Senior Member

02-25-2013

What it should be: pick order is the ultimatum. If you want to be the bigger person and increase your chances of winning, learn all roles and offer to fill. But in the end, pick order supersedes call order.