@Xyph, is resists being less effective than health in S3 bad design?

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hashinshin

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Trundle has one of the lowest armor values in the game. It starts off normal for a bruiser then scales as if he's heimerdinger. This has annoyed me for years.


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Sessamo

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xhandel View Post
still saying, Xypherous, what do you think abou Void staff dealing the same amount of damage than rabbadons past 80 mr, rabbadons should be the item who granted the biggest amount of AP damage, almost for the vast majority of the AP carry champs, but there is an option with a cost 800g lower than hat, then, why to build hat, the other options granted better survivability and other cool efects like cdr and all of them are cheaper.

The best AP item is now too useless to be the Tier 1 AP item
I think that's probably how things should work, isn't it? Your big mpen item gives you more damage when they build a ton of MR?
Why should Rabadon's give you the most damage and the most AP, when AP gives most mids a form of defense as well as offense?


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Xhandel

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Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sessamo View Post
I think that's probably how things should work, isn't it? Your big mpen item gives you more damage when they build a ton of MR?
Why should Rabadon's give you the most damage and the most AP, when AP gives most mids a form of defense as well as offense?
as i say, then why to have Hat, Void staff its supposed to be the counterplay against high mr, now that everyone ends the game with 100+ mr, it takes the place of hat, DFG grants you damage and cdr, zhonyas grant you survivability, then why i to get hat


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IS13940001471ffbdf28d0e

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Xyph, stacking health maybe is what you said, but you cannot deny that Warmog is cheap.


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Xypherous

Systems Designer

01-24-2013
20 of 27 Riot Posts

Quote:
I think that's probably how things should work, isn't it? Your big mpen item gives you more damage when they build a ton of MR?
Why should Rabadon's give you the most damage and the most AP, when AP gives most mids a form of defense as well as offense?
I think he's saying that 80 MR is too low of an MR threshold for this to be true. I'm kind of inclined to agree - but that would mean nerfing void staff or buffing Deathcap.

Nerfing void staff is probably straight out - but Deathcap might be weak? It's uncertain. I'll try to get Roku to look at it some more when he gets the chance.

(It's weird because it actually heavily depends on your champion's AP ratios to base damage.)

Quote:
Xyph, stacking health maybe is what you said, but you cannot deny that Warmog is cheap.
Yeah, on PBE the cost of Warmog's is inching up slightly by 180 gold or so.

We'll keep adjusting the cost until we feel like it's in a decent spot. Like I said, I'm not saying the current tuning is perfect and that we've definitely overshot this patch - but we'll keep tuning it until it is.


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Phil Nye

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by hashinshin View Post
Trundle has one of the lowest armor values in the game. It starts off normal for a bruiser then scales as if he's heimerdinger. This has annoyed me for years.
I've noticed this too, it made me buy armor in S2 earlier/in situations I normally wouldn't worry about on other bruisers.


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NotBuzzJack

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Xypherous speaking of resists and penetration, is Xerath having 40% mpen from Locus really balanced in S3?


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XuWarrior

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Dear Community / Xyph

Also PPL mentality need to change. It was Never AP MID................. It's Community Mentality.
Player need to understand it was role Top Lane , Mid Lane, Bot Lane.
Now when you took something from them ( took is hyperbolic) they are confused and sometimes rage.

There is no such thing like AP CARRY MID... (if you dont remm. S1 times , Europe had meta AD carry mid) , it was NA meta that AP goes mid...


Now at least We players have diversity , and it "forcing us" to understand more champion pool not only AP GOES mid...


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NotBuzzJack

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xypherous View Post
Yeah, on PBE the cost of Warmog's is inching up slightly by 180 gold or so.
I don't believe that's been implemented yet. PBE has only gotten air client patches lately.


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Sessamo

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xypherous View Post
I think he's saying that 80 MR is too low of an MR threshold for this to be true. I'm kind of inclined to agree - but that would mean nerfing void staff or buffing Deathcap.

Nerfing void staff is probably straight out - but Deathcap might be weak? It's uncertain. I'll try to get Roku to look at it some more when he gets the chance.
I guess that's true. I personally haven't seen many MR values hitting 100+ until a bulwark is finished, but that could be a personal bias.
I personally feel like it's hard to ever really complain about AP itemization now that so many mages gain a form of sustained damage in addition to burst and utility, but I will concede that when so many players feel contrary I could be in the wrong.