Ziggs and the a few tweaks he needs

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Baalhrezem

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Senior Member

12-04-2012

I've been playing a lot of Ziggs recently. Nothing too much but learning his mechanics.

I am concerned about the similarities between other champions and how they function differently when they shouldn't.

His passive needs to be function identically with Twisted Fate. In case you didn't know Twisted Fate's blue card, E proc, and sheen/lichbane. Are on a set priority.

If you would kill a minion with Blue Card, you keep your sheen and E proc.
If you would kill a minion with the damage from Blue Card and Sheen, but E would be overkill, you keep your E for the next attack.
If it takes Blue Card damage, sheen, and your E to kill a minion, all three will go off whether it kills it or not.

Similarly, Ziggs passive needs to work like this.

If killing a minion with basic attack damage (plus spellblade) would kill it, you keep your passive and sheen.
If killing a minion with sheen would kill it, you keep your passive.
If killing a minion with sheen and passive would kill it, both will go off whether it kills it or not.

Applicable to towers too.

Because the current way it works is you lose your passive's extra damage if it would kill the minion. Even TF gets mana back if the minion dies before it reaches it hitting air, why should Ziggs lose his passive for 12 seconds if the same happens to him?

Q - Well done, no need for tweaking and not buggy.

W - It needs the Gragas barrel/Lux treatment/Riven Q/etc.

The way it currently works is the CD is counted when it goes off, not when it is planted.

Gragas Q is on a 7 second cooldown, a 4.2 second cooldown with 40% CDR. He can choose to leave the barrel for zoning purposes for 3 seconds. Once the barrel explodes, the CD is 1.2 seconds because it is counted down in the background when he throws it, not when it explodes. This same thing applies to Lux and even rivens Q. Abilities like this need to function identically across the board--Ziggs is not the only one.

E is fine, the potential damage from it is a little absurd but is a closet case scenario and they are likely to never hit more than 4.

R is great. Nothing buggy about it.

I hope you take my input/feedback seriously as the last time I made one of these for Lux, they actually took what I said and digested it. Thank you for reading.


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Baalhrezem

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Senior Member

12-06-2012

Bumping so it's not forgotten.


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Myrmidont

Senior Member

12-06-2012

I think his passive is a little weird how it can trigger on failed auto attacks, I want that fixed.

On using it for a kill that you could've done normally I think thats just bad usage and shouldn't be changed.

Also I had no idea that tf's abilities worked like that, I thought they were the same as ziggs as in being wasted on failed autos.


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masterdragon481

Senior Member

12-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Myrmidont View Post
I think his passive is a little weird how it can trigger on failed auto attacks, I want that fixed.

On using it for a kill that you could've done normally I think thats just bad usage and shouldn't be changed.

Also I had no idea that tf's abilities worked like that, I thought they were the same as ziggs as in being wasted on failed autos.
I do not play ziggs, but i do not see how you can call "bad usage" on a passive that applies on auto attack, hes not choosing when the stronger auto goes off. I agree with the OP. Although I only would want to point out that his W is a good CC and a large escape mechanism for him, having it reset when its placed *could* be a problem......


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DesertFox

Senior Member

12-06-2012

Not sure if any impact this change would leave at all.


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Masuhara

Senior Member

12-07-2012

nice post.

ziggs is cool and fun but i always think why play ziggs when lux does everything better.

long range poke, snares/slows, sniping top or bot from long range.

imo ziggs needs some tlc b/c he is just inferior to her in every way.

the cd on ziggs w is ridiki, it should be reduced by 1 sec for each aa made or q bomb hit or something.

oh hey look!!! another thing ziggs and lux have in common!!!!

24 sec cd on ziggs w, 24 sec cd on lux ult! hows that happen?


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Krosan

Senior Member

12-07-2012

I definitely agree that letting W cool down while placed would be a helpful thing (though in the past I've also argued for a similar treatment for Xerath's ult, since right now he's really heavily incentivized to just dump everything all at once).


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Baalhrezem

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Senior Member

12-19-2012

Bump because this somehow got forgotten.


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SooFr0sty

Member

12-19-2012

One thing they need to do is make it so when you cast your w it doesnt make him stop moving


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Gwri

Junior Member

12-19-2012

I haven't use Twisted Fate before so I have no idea about his skills or his passive, but I do own Ziggs (I rarely play him nowadays). TS has a very strong point on Ziggs "W", I think that the CD timer should start when the satchel is planted. For a utility skill, the pathetic damage is understandable, but the CD can be improved and I believe that TS suggestion could be the answer. Let us hope the Riot will overlook this matter.


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