You won't be banned for having bad games

First Riot Post
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ThereRnoIDs

Member

11-21-2012

Lyte your really going to turn a blind eye to false reports for these 2 games and say its justifiable?
I've even attached the replays for your amusement.

Tell me where was it a constant switching during the laning phase. I spent 6 minutes in mid, never did I start off with ad items, and our supposedly ad teemo went ap after we switched lanes at mere 4 minutes. Creeps get to lane about 2 3 minutes for Ur information.

Gtg Be back in 5 hrs...


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Dokrantus

Junior Member

11-21-2012

1st Game : 6/13/7
2nd Game : 3/15/10
Feeder..


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BestPlayerAIive

Junior Member

11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyte View Post
This isn't a mistake. This punishment is deserved.

This player has received over 1000 reports in 900ish games. That's a staggering number that almost no players ever reach. Consider that the average player receives about 4-5 reports every 100 games and you can see how absurd the difference is. This is an example of a case that the Tribunal is not extremely effective at resolving because the player is extremely negative in more subtle ways such as in pre- and post-game chat. However, after review of the chat logs I'm going to leave the ban as is. It's my belief that this player understands quite well what kind of behaviors he should work on to avoid this happening again.
Number of reports should do absolutely nothing towards getting someone banned unless there is relevant reason in each of those reports.

Saying, "This guy said something nasty in pre/post-game" should do absolutely nothing towards getting someone banned until those are included in Tribunal reports.

The verbal abuse someone receives should 100% be relevant towards reports. No, I'm not saying it should be okay for people to troll because they got **** talked, however the Tribunal should be able to punish people who are verbally abusing another player even if the current report they are reviewing isn't about that player.

I think the important fact you are glossing over, is the player in question who was punished by the Tribunal for the games seen. The fact people are even reporting these games is ridiculous.

Lyte, I challenge you to lurk on Streams for the next two months of professional players/popular streamers and then at the end of those months hand out bans based on their behavior. Make sure to permanently ban them when they deserve it and make sure that they don't start streaming on new accounts or participate in tournaments.


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Fat of the Land

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Senior Member

11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyte View Post
This isn't a mistake. This punishment is deserved.
The issue isn't whether it is deserved but the fact that the tribunal case does not show any of the behaviour or chat logs that would warrant a ban, and yet the player was still punished. Clearly the Tribunal provides inadequate relevant information.


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BestPlayerAIive

Junior Member

11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat of the Land View Post
The issue isn't whether it is deserved but the fact that the tribunal case does not show any of the behaviour or chat logs that would warrant a ban, and yet the player was still punished. Clearly the Tribunal provides inadequate relevant information.
And clearly the people using the Tribunal are using it incorrectly.

Being able to find something that the player has done negatively from a Riot employee isn't relevant at that point either. It's like if a police officer took someone in for stealing a car, couldn't find concrete information about it, but the officer finds proof the guy jaywalked the other day... GUILTY!


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Dazrix

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Senior Member

11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat of the Land View Post
The issue isn't whether it is deserved but the fact that the tribunal case does not show any of the behaviour or chat logs that would warrant a ban, and yet the player was still punished. Clearly the Tribunal provides inadequate relevant information.
This has exactly been my problem with the tribunal aswell....

If this guy truely did recieve 1000 reports in 900 games, as Lyte said, then I would think that he truely is that bad (thats a lot of time to invest)

OR

He truely just proved, what people like myself have been arguing for a long time - your tribunal is heavily flawed, and bias BECAUSE the tribunal has had no reason to punish, especially since having a bad game isn't worthy of punishment. Thus, needs to be either removed, or reworked.


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Lyte

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Lead Social Systems Designer

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11-21-2012
2 of 4 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat of the Land View Post
The issue isn't whether it is deserved but the fact that the tribunal case does not show any of the behaviour or chat logs that would warrant a ban, and yet the player was still punished. Clearly the Tribunal provides inadequate relevant information.
There's a few discussion points here. Is the Tribunal perfect? No, not even close. Is it highly accurate in a vast majority of cases? Yes.

Could the Tribunal use more information? Sure, but that's why it's an iterative process that we keep improving on over time. The Tribunal you see today is vastly improved in both efficiency and transparency compared to the Tribunal 1 year ago. We're going to keep fine tuning these systems.

But here's another interesting point: even though players have less information, if they come to the same decision Riot staff would make, is that considered case considered "correct?" I reviewed the case and I wouldn't lift the ban. That doesn't mean the Tribunal is perfect--we are going to keep working on it and improving it.


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Swallow My Gravy

Member

11-21-2012

Just get rid of the tribunal already before you ruin this game...The trolls arent going anywhere but the decent players are.


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Orconem

Senior Member

11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyte View Post
This isn't a mistake. This punishment is deserved.

This player has received over 1000 reports in 900ish games. That's a staggering number that almost no players ever reach. Consider that the average player receives about 4-5 reports every 100 games and you can see how absurd the difference is. This is an example of a case that the Tribunal is not extremely effective at resolving because the player is extremely negative in more subtle ways such as in pre- and post-game chat. However, after review of the chat logs I'm going to leave the ban as is. It's my belief that this player understands quite well what kind of behaviors he should work on to avoid this happening again.
See, this is what confuses me about the Tribunal. If he's been reported that much, why does he only have two games on his reform card? Most people who post their cards have five games on it and it's pretty obvious what they did was wrong. You'd think with over 1000 reports the Tribunal system would give people more than two games to work with.


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Youkai Ningen

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Senior Member

11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swallow My Gravy View Post
Just get rid of the tribunal already before you ruin this game...The trolls arent going anywhere but the decent players are.
I see no problem at all with the Tribunal, I play a fair amount of games each day and have yet to even be warned by the Tribunal.

One thing I am curious about though is how does the Tribunal decide the number of games it will show in each case? Wouldn't it be Ideal to have like a set number instead of it being (seemingly) random?