Jayce really needa nerf?

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Arcticfury

Senior Member

10-25-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by GodLynn View Post
can ppl nerf the ppl who need nerfing instead of losing a game and getting mad and say imma nerf him waaaa waaaaaaa let me read forums and come up with a way to nerf him
Jayce needed nerfed, and of the nerfs, he was QQ'd about less than Rengar, and less than Darius (who doesn't and didn't get nerfed). So Riot must have their own agenda, so what you said makes absolutely no sense.

QQ more, I love that he got nerfed, and I hope they nerf him more so the QQers whine more, not because I think he needs it.


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IonDragonX

Senior Member

10-25-2012

I remember when Jayce came out, people thought that he was weak.....


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Vrael27

Senior Member

10-25-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vivi R66 View Post
they are nerfing ALL %HP based skills that got overused because were too strong, Deathfire got a nerf, Eve ult got a nerf, Jayce knock back got a nerf

jayce could jump you and toss you away, done, harassed, safelly even
take some of that damage away is fair to me

also, he regenerates mana each smack he does with hammer, so the mana cost increase is more than fair, his mana sustain is still high
No, it's not.

obviously you haven't played Jayce much.
Jayce's mana sustain before was very bad, and was hard to have near enough mana even with the passive on his w.

Jayce has many skills, all take huge mana, and the amount of minions that are needed to kill in order to get that mana back is just too much for him to have good sustain. Before nerf Jayce players had to be smart about mana use cause one full combo with all of his skills would easily drain all of his mana. Now add in a huge mana cost on his best utility, harass spell, and escape...

Now Jayce has to constantly try to farm, trying to hit every minion over and over for mana. This leaves him open for harass, then when he tries to harass back he is left with even less mana, if he even had any mana to harass back with, if not then he is taking dmg that he can do nothing about.

The worst part is that by doing this, he can't harass much without losing mana, then when he tries to get mana back he will be auto attacking minions instead of last hitting them, which would force him to push his lane, and leave himself open to jungle ganks. and when the jungle ganks he won't be able to use his escape because it now takes more mana, so he no longer has mana from trying to harass, he pushed lane trying to get mana back, and now he doesn't have mana to escape.

The mana cost increase on Acceleration Gate was not needed, Jayce already was mana hungry and had to be used conservatively.

And as for the hammer mode e nerf.... his e wasn't really a problem Jayce players that didn't know how to properly play him would max his e first, like i have seen many new jayce players do, but what they don't realize is that if they max his e they get 1 strong hammer atk the hits their enemy away so they can't follow up, however maxing q gives you a amazing harass skill and strong slow and attack.

By nerfing e you are just showing new Jayce players that the smart thing to do is max his q first. not to mention you just took away a huge chunk of his dmg.

IMO this nerf was just a bit too much, and the mana increase was just not needed -.-


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Vivi R66

Senior Member

10-25-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrael27 View Post
No, it's not.

obviously you haven't played Jayce much.
Jayce's mana sustain before was very bad, and was hard to have near enough mana even with the passive on his w.

Jayce has many skills, all take huge mana, and the amount of minions that are needed to kill in order to get that mana back is just too much for him to have good sustain. Before nerf Jayce players had to be smart about mana use cause one full combo with all of his skills would easily drain all of his mana. Now add in a huge mana cost on his best utility, harass spell, and escape...

Now Jayce has to constantly try to farm, trying to hit every minion over and over for mana. This leaves him open for harass, then when he tries to harass back he is left with even less mana, if he even had any mana to harass back with, if not then he is taking dmg that he can do nothing about.

The worst part is that by doing this, he can't harass much without losing mana, then when he tries to get mana back he will be auto attacking minions instead of last hitting them, which would force him to push his lane, and leave himself open to jungle ganks. and when the jungle ganks he won't be able to use his escape because it now takes more mana, so he no longer has mana from trying to harass, he pushed lane trying to get mana back, and now he doesn't have mana to escape.

The mana cost increase on Acceleration Gate was not needed, Jayce already was mana hungry and had to be used conservatively.

And as for the hammer mode e nerf.... his e wasn't really a problem Jayce players that didn't know how to properly play him would max his e first, like i have seen many new jayce players do, but what they don't realize is that if they max his e they get 1 strong hammer atk the hits their enemy away so they can't follow up, however maxing q gives you a amazing harass skill and strong slow and attack.

By nerfing e you are just showing new Jayce players that the smart thing to do is max his q first. not to mention you just took away a huge chunk of his dmg.

IMO this nerf was just a bit too much, and the mana increase was just not needed -.-

I played Jayce, not too much, but I feel his sustain is fine, the nerfs arent so strong you cant work arround them, will stop the easy mode play (if you fear for your sustain, get more than one point in W, sacrifices your damage, sure, but still option on the table lol), its not like they took Jayce and made "rengar nerfs" on him lol


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EffectFX

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Senior Member

10-25-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrael27 View Post
No, it's not.

obviously you haven't played Jayce much.
Jayce's mana sustain before was very bad, and was hard to have near enough mana even with the passive on his w.

Jayce has many skills, all take huge mana, and the amount of minions that are needed to kill in order to get that mana back is just too much for him to have good sustain. Before nerf Jayce players had to be smart about mana use cause one full combo with all of his skills would easily drain all of his mana. Now add in a huge mana cost on his best utility, harass spell, and escape...

Now Jayce has to constantly try to farm, trying to hit every minion over and over for mana. This leaves him open for harass, then when he tries to harass back he is left with even less mana, if he even had any mana to harass back with, if not then he is taking dmg that he can do nothing about.

The worst part is that by doing this, he can't harass much without losing mana, then when he tries to get mana back he will be auto attacking minions instead of last hitting them, which would force him to push his lane, and leave himself open to jungle ganks. and when the jungle ganks he won't be able to use his escape because it now takes more mana, so he no longer has mana from trying to harass, he pushed lane trying to get mana back, and now he doesn't have mana to escape.

The mana cost increase on Acceleration Gate was not needed, Jayce already was mana hungry and had to be used conservatively.

And as for the hammer mode e nerf.... his e wasn't really a problem Jayce players that didn't know how to properly play him would max his e first, like i have seen many new jayce players do, but what they don't realize is that if they max his e they get 1 strong hammer atk the hits their enemy away so they can't follow up, however maxing q gives you a amazing harass skill and strong slow and attack.

By nerfing e you are just showing new Jayce players that the smart thing to do is max his q first. not to mention you just took away a huge chunk of his dmg.

IMO this nerf was just a bit too much, and the mana increase was just not needed -.-
Jayce was hardly mana hungry before, I never used any mana regen, in runes, masteries, or items, and I was able to combo harass with Q+E all lane long and hardly ever ran out of mana. You're probably doing it wrong.


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Vrael27

Senior Member

10-25-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vivi R66 View Post
I played Jayce, not too much, but I feel his sustain is fine, the nerfs arent so strong you cant work arround them, will stop the easy mode play (if you fear for your sustain, get more than one point in W, sacrifices your damage, sure, but still option on the table lol), its not like they took Jayce and made "rengar nerfs" on him lol
Rengar did get harder nerfs, but i still feel the mana increase just wasn't needed.

People don't realize that even in late game Jayce is fairly pressed for mana after burning just 1 combo, since he has twice as many spells as other champs, and now his spells are more costly than champs with only 4 spells!

Although, i have no clue why everyone says that he has good laning phase, but bad late game. Jayce is my main and i figure it the other way around.

Early game his mana is his downfall, going into melee range to get harassed, and pushing lane is all he can do to get some mana back. But late game his mana is a bit better, and he is very strong if he is able to steal enemy blue, or kill an enemy with blue. Also, if Jayce is built right, he is very very strong late game, that is one of reasons he is my favorite champ.
Not cause he has good poke and good laning phase (which isn't the best when considering mana issues) but because a Jayce with Trinity Force, Warmogs, and Atma's Impaler, is basically impossible to kill, or escape from.

I know it sounds like i'm QQing over mana issues... but that was the worst part about Jayce, and now has, instead of lowering one of his many strong points, has just taken his weak point, and just dragged him farther down with it.


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Vrael27

Senior Member

10-25-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by EffectFX View Post
Jayce was hardly mana hungry before, I never used any mana regen, in runes, masteries, or items, and I was able to combo harass with Q+E all lane long and hardly ever ran out of mana. You're probably doing it wrong.
i'm not "doing it wrong" i don't run outta mana on him either, and i don't build any mana regen, but with this nerf it might be necessary to build mana regen or something...

i'm just worried that the nerf might make Jayce too pressed for mana.


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EffectFX

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Senior Member

10-25-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrael27 View Post
Rengar did get harder nerfs, but i still feel the mana increase just wasn't needed.

People don't realize that even in late game Jayce is fairly pressed for mana after burning just 1 combo, since he has twice as many spells as other champs, and now his spells are more costly than champs with only 4 spells!

Although, i have no clue why everyone says that he has good laning phase, but bad late game. Jayce is my main and i figure it the other way around.

Early game his mana is his downfall, going into melee range to get harassed, and pushing lane is all he can do to get some mana back. But late game his mana is a bit better, and he is very strong if he is able to steal enemy blue, or kill an enemy with blue. Also, if Jayce is built right, he is very very strong late game, that is one of reasons he is my favorite champ.
Not cause he has good poke and good laning phase (which isn't the best when considering mana issues) but because a Jayce with Trinity Force, Warmogs, and Atma's Impaler, is basically impossible to kill, or escape from.

I know it sounds like i'm QQing over mana issues... but that was the worst part about Jayce, and now has, instead of lowering one of his many strong points, has just taken his weak point, and just dragged him farther down with it.
I don't see why you're running out of mana/having issues with mana in lane, unless you're just spamming spells because you can, instead of harassing with autoattacks and only using spells when necessary.


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IS1f715232b540cb2fffcee

Senior Member

10-25-2012

manacost increase on gate was needed, damagereduction on knockback was needed.

Taking away all the basedamage seems harsh, but so do most of the nerfs riot did this patch.
I guess they want to really make something happen for season 3.


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Vrael27

Senior Member

10-25-2012

Also, most top champs have much better sustain than Jayce.

For example:

Top champions with build in lifesteal have much better sustain than Jayce, and if they simply get a bit of harass off on him, or stay behind minions, or dodge his harass, then he will run out of mana, they can harass him, and he won't be able to sustain cause he doesn't have any built in lifesteal.

Other top champs like Irelia, Fiora, Xin Zhao, Nocturne, Shen, Warwick, and etc. have built in lifesteal or some kind of sustain that they can use to heal themselves so they can stay in lane longer.

Even top champs that don't have some sort of built in lifesteal or ability to regenerate health are still good at harassing and escaping harass. A good example of this is Wukong. Wukong can q in, then just disappear so he can't be harassed back, and if u mistake his clone for him then you take more dmg. Wukong can just repeat this, staying safely away until he can harass, and then ulting when you have somewhat low health, usually picking up the kill using this method. Compared to other top champs like Jax, Xin Zhao, Fiora, Wukong, Yorick, etc. Jayce just really isn't that op, or that amazing at the laning phase.

He does have good harass, but has mana issues, built in lifesteal or health regen, a targeted q which can be dodged, a knockback that will hit your enemy away from you so u can't follow up (inless you get in front of them which is hard cause he doesn't have a very fast movement speed), and his only harass is a 2 spell harass that the enemy can clearly see when a Jayce player is about to q & e them. Also his harass doesn't go over minions, so it can be blocked.

So mana is not the only thing Jayce players have to worry about win laning against other powerful top champs. Based on this, other top champs can beat them using better sustain, smart thinking, and positioning. So i really don't think Jayce was OP, or that he needed this nerf.

Although the fix on his e does make sense.


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