Locked Camera Discussion

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GodDamnedBatman

Senior Member

04-13-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Powerstoned View Post
IMO, the best way to get more people to use an unlocked camera, is allowing players to zoom out more, 25-50% more. The problem for me is mostly using skill shots with a long aiming arrow/range.

When playing unlocked during play, if I'm moving away from an enemy champion, but wish to aim/use a long skill shot the opposite way my champ is moving, if I accidently get 1 pixel too close to the screen edge with my cursor while aiming, I'm borked. (lux is a good example I find). I lose my champion from the screen, and my camera view is thrown way off.

Scroll out more. Really it's my only complaint with the game, because it seems so easy to remedy. My guess is the most zoomed out view would be the new "normal" and would make the game look less nice in screenshots/video and detract from the cool looking champs and skins, and your marketing department doesn't want the game to look less pretty.
+1

i personally have learned to sitch between them, i mostly play on locked but when i need some more vision to fire a skillshot or just see ahead of me into a battle or something, i pop the 'y' on and off

now, if that ^ isnt something contemplated in the skillpool to play lol then the zoom out would be a magnificant solution as it would allow players who prefer locked camera to play way easier, while players who prefer floating camera still get what they want

Edit:

Also an idea i came up a while ago was that for champions who use large skillshots have the camera move to where youre pointing the skillshot ( like centering the camera in the middle of the skillshot trail so you see your champion on one end and the end of the skillshot in the other) and have it centger again once u fired, or in the case of long radial range, like tf cards, have it zoom out a bit, then center agiain once you have fired


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Best Atheist NA

Senior Member

04-14-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Werewolf Link View Post
Allow us to zoom out further.
This. It's not a full solution, but a good start in the right direction. I think boourns said they don't want to allow anymore zoom because it might give people who play on bigger monitor's an advantage, but I don't see a real issue with it.


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KusAchtak

Senior Member

04-14-2012

Hey boourns, a question:
Any chance of cancelling the camera snapping back to my hero on blue pill or respawn?
It feels totally unnecessary. It makes me go the wrong way for half a second if I spam right click while I'm dead, eager to get back to the fray.

Could it at least be made a toggle-able option?


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ChaosBloodterfly

Senior Member

04-14-2012

On #11, is faking an eyefinity setup/messing with screen resolutions bannable (no zoom hacks, just config edits)? You can set resolution in the config.ini file. If you have a 1920x 1080 monitor, you gain a significant amount of view by setting the resolution to something like 1920x 640.


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Sedgitize

Junior Member

04-14-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by boourns View Post
I don't think I can disclose exact stats numbers, but I can tell you it is nowhere near 50/50 when we look at players who have the option for locked camera set on their computer. It's far, far less. A fraction of the size of our colorblind population in fact. Unfortunately, this makes it hard to lobby for changes which would change the experience for the vast majority of other players.

Also, as an aside, this is why we generally can't use forum polls as data for decision making (other than to find out interesting ideas from our players). Only a small part of our players actively participate in the forum and they select themselves which adds bias. Further, the ones that participate in a poll are even more self-selected because they must be interested in the topic in some way to even get into the post. Finally, they are probably biased to agree with the post for the same reason if they vote unless it is a very contentious issue. People who don't care likely won't vote or even read the post. So, while the poll that you refer to about camera changes indicates that people want the idea, it is likely that it only represents a small group of people... people who play with locked camera and want changes to the camera system.
Ah, the bane of my theory lol.

Also, if there are issues that are higher priorities, then by all means, focus on those issues. I imagine that colorblind players are suffering at the moment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Powerstoned View Post
IMO, the best way to get more people to use an unlocked camera, is allowing players to zoom out more, 25-50% more. The problem for me is mostly using skill shots with a long aiming arrow/range.

When playing unlocked during play, if I'm moving away from an enemy champion, but wish to aim/use a long skill shot the opposite way my champ is moving, if I accidently get 1 pixel too close to the screen edge with my cursor while aiming, I'm borked. (lux is a good example I find). I lose my champion from the screen, and my camera view is thrown way off.

Scroll out more. Really it's my only complaint with the game, because it seems so easy to remedy. My guess is the most zoomed out view would be the new "normal" and would make the game look less nice in screenshots/video and detract from the cool looking champs and skins, and your marketing department doesn't want the game to look less pretty.
This would help a lot, and it seems like an easy fix. This would allow people on purple side to actually have the view they need, and for the junglers to have better ability to gank down. This really seems like the easiest and most helpful solution.

The only other fix idea that I would consider really useful would be switching the camera angle for purple so that it would be similar to that of blue. It need not hinder team communication as everyone one team would still have the same view as everyone else on their team. I do see how that could require a lot of work, for an issue that you don't seem to believe affects many players.


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Kai Talakki

Member

04-14-2012

It may not be a "big issue" for the majority, but for the percentage that does prefer and use locked camera, being on the purple team can make an otherwise normal game absolutely miserable. With a locked camera, the UI can be devastating. It can block an enemy champion who is lining up for a skillshot that you could otherwise see and easily avoid if you were blue. If you try using unlocked camera, but are not used to doing so or just plain don't like it, the accidental scrolling of the camera in a crucial moment can cause a death that otherwise would not have happened if you were on blue team. It also hinders my ability to throw skillshots, because I find myself accidentally moving the mouse too far and end up losing sight of my target. Even worse when I'm running away and trying to land a skillshot that could save me.

I know the complaints have been voiced before, and undoubtedly I will get responses telling me to "learn to use unlocked camera", but I honestly prefer it for the ability to always be aware of where I am. I do unlock now and then when I am not in a battle and want to see what's going on with my teammates, but if I'm in the middle of a fight or about to be, I like to know where my champion is.

I also suppose I do not understand what the problem is with having purple's camera not directly centered on the champion, enough to give you the same range of view that blue has in front of you. It wouldn't add any view range that blue doesn't have, and wouldn't take away any view range that blue has. The only thing that it would detract from is being able to see behind you, but blue doesn't get as far of a back-view because it's blocked by the UI. This would also not affect the players who play with an unlocked camera, and would even the playing field for those who play with a locked camera.


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David Hume

Senior Member

04-14-2012

I don't play with a locked camera and there are still a few problem points with the camera for me.

One is one is seeing Kog's ult when on purple side. The ideal camera position when Kog is attacking you from below is to have your own character at the top of the screen so you can see Kog - and since the warning line for his ult is directly above where it lands, most if not all of that red line is off the screen. You literally can't see it coming without sacrificing your ability to see who's attacking you (i.e., seeing the launch animation start). The problem is worst right around purple's mid inhibitor turret, when blue team is seiging you. Solution: give kog's ult some kind of warning particle on the ground as well. I understand that you don't want to mess with the viewing angle (personally I'd love top down view, tired of Blitz's broad shoulders causing me to click on the wrong person) but at least don't make game critical animations depend on it.

The other (and far worse problem) is when you're playing Kog'maw or Xerath, ulting into a teamfight from a safe distance... and then all of a sudden your attacks stop happening. You frantically click, but artillery fails to fall out of the sky. Two seconds later you get the Grey Screen bug, and only then do you realize that Lee Sin came from behind and ulted you out of range. It's hard to tell where everyone is at the best of times with all the lights of spells flashing everywhere - suddenly getting knocked out of where you thought you were means that you waste valuable half seconds in a teamfight hitting space to find where you landed and then trying to figure where that is relative to everyone else. Solution: (rapidly) scroll the view to the character when you get knocked out of your position by anything more substantial than Maokai's little push. It doesn't even have to center on you, just move until you're visible again.


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Lecheris

Junior Member

04-14-2012

What if there was an option to flip the map? For me I do enjoy locked play better than unlocked. I do seem to realize for myself that blue side is easier to skill shot from than purple, by a large margin, but what if there could be an option that could flip the whole map. Ex. Say I get into a game and I'm placed on purple side. I hit and option button and instead of going on the map from top to bottom, I'm now going from bottom to top. To get a better idea of this, Baron would be on the bottom of my new flipped map, and dragon would be at the top.


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David Hume

Senior Member

04-14-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by KusAchtak View Post
Hey boourns, a question:
Any chance of cancelling the camera snapping back to my hero on blue pill or respawn?
It feels totally unnecessary. It makes me go the wrong way for half a second if I spam right click while I'm dead, eager to get back to the fray.

Could it at least be made a toggle-able option?
This - I'm often holding a hand over the teleport key to jump back into a running fight and the camera's like NOPE SCROLL BACK TO YOUR CARRY GETTING MANHANDLED LOSER.


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Kalafai

Senior Member

04-14-2012

I use locked camera... maybe I don't show up in your stats at that because I haven't found the option to change that on my side, I just toggle it at the start of the game.

I like to play highly mobile champions, or ones that require constant input. Spamming me some skillshots is much more fun than auto attacks, and even auto attacks sometimes I send each one to a different target at 2.1 attack speed.

On trying the unlocked camera, I found it neither smooth nor precise enough for those times when I need it stationary to watch for enemy champions in lane stepping out of bushes to get into range, when I want to target champions I am chasing, or just laugh maniacally and throw bombs in all the bushes along the way so I can hear them calling out "maphacks" in chat.

Also, with the number of clicks I'm already giving to dodge and weave against skill shots, attack those minions, and precisely aim my own skillshots, I don't have time to wave at the edges of the screen, click the minimap, or depress middle mouse and swing the screen wildly, as my mouse is all tied up in the action.

I can't be holding spacebar for camera locking while doing that either, since I am very attentive and aggressive, and holding spacebar for 10 minutes solid during a game makes my thumb go numb.

I find skillshot ranges easier to judge in locked camera because of the camera angle making the distance across the screen they can travel be different by how far back or how near the camera is.

So I like totally learned how to land Caitlyn glaives and Ashe arrows by glancing at the minimap, and just firing off the corrected degrees. Artillery Skillz, Yo!


As for my LoL mentor who uses unlocked camera... well, I don't see it helping much, really, as they tunnel vision to their target, and run off without seeing the ambushes going off behind them and the rest of their team being killed as they plan to tank a tower for us or something. Or watch a fight, or their own Ashe arrow, and get walked up to and smacked by the enemy while paying attention to another person's lane.


Now to tackle the list of proposed solutions...

Flipping the camera for purple team:

Argument Against: Flips all important position of Barron Nasher and Dragon.

My rebuttal to the argument: Unflips jungle. It's more important to me when I play an AD carry to grab the small golem camp before minion waves meet to be the first to level 2, than it is for me to worry about someone trying to solo dragon the moment it spawns. If I have lane supperiority by that point, I can temp mid while mr AP and Jungler and Bruiser tackle any attempted dragoning.

Argument Against: Well, it does make front attacks and laning easier, but it makes purple teams have more trouble circling around behind towers to get into position for teamfights.

My rebuttal: Wha?
Expanded: What do I care?
Expandeder: How often does this come into play for my entire team even if I'm winding through the jungle to pick off retreating champions.
Expandederest: Why the hell am I zigzagging through the jungle with a slow AD carry with massively long skillshots when I could be attacking from the front where it is both safer, and I can get to in time even iff my team is circling.

Argument Against: Causes people communication not able to tell which way is top or bottem.

My rebuttal: Why are you communicating with blue team, the only people who aren't flipped as well?

Make spacebar disable camera lock on hold for locked players like it enables camera lock on hold for unlocked players.

Argument Against: Play unlocked NOOB

Rebuttal: *close thread*

Argument Against: Press Y, NOOB!

Rebuttal: Already do, but holding and toggling are apparnatly different enough you don't do it yourself, and it seems a very easy change.

Argument Against: Not as easy as holding spacebar the whole time!

Rebuttal: Hold spacebar for 40 minutes, say it was easy, and I'll never argue with you again.

Change Camera angle closer to straight down on the map.

Argument Against: You wouldn't be able to tell champions appart.

Rebuttal: I'm pretty sure Chogoth's back is different from TF's hat.

Argument Against: You wouldnt be able to stare at Sivir's legs while she runs.

Rebuttal: I'll take overhead of her rack anyday anyways.

But really, that's a joke entry.

Argument Against: Your field of view has been precisely calculated and this would affect game balance.

Rebuttal: Yeah right. Rather than play full screen at 16:10 resolution, I play windowed at 16:9, and can see 2 tank minions farther on either side. This has affected my combat, and the directions I pick to gank from. I really don't think you care that much.