which pen applies first in damage calculation: flat or %?

flat pen (sorc shoes) 36 85.71%
%pen (void staff) 6 14.29%
Voters: 42. You may not vote on this poll

%pen vs. flat pen

First Riot Post
12
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julianjuvenile

Senior Member

10-26-2011

which applies first? i've always though it was flat pen, but i just read somewhere that % pen applies first.
can you clarify please?


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Meddler

Lead Champion Designer

10-26-2011
1 of 2 Riot Posts

Flat then percent.


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Yelling Guy

Senior Member

10-27-2011

%reduction applies first; the only thing I can think of at the moment with %reduction is Urgot's E.


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Redenbacher

Senior Member

10-27-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yelling Guy View Post
%reduction applies first; the only thing I can think of at the moment with %reduction is Urgot's E.
Kayle's passive, Nidalee's Bushwhack, and Trundle's Agony also give % reduction.


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J4CKAL

Senior Member

10-27-2011

FLat pen.


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Eledhan

Senior Member

10-27-2011

The correct order of all Armor Redux / Pen is:

Armor Reduction %
Armor Reduction Flat
Armor Penetration Flat
Armor Penetration %

Source:

.

Hope that helps!

Although this is the supposed order, I feel like the flat redux from Stark's might be at the top of the list...since it is already in effect prior to any skills or other item redux procs.


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ricklessabandon

qa analyst

10-27-2011
2 of 2 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eledhan View Post
The correct order of all Armor Redux / Pen is:

Armor Reduction %
Armor Reduction Flat
Armor Penetration Flat
Armor Penetration %

Source:

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Armor_penetration

Hope that helps!

Although this is the supposed order, I feel like the flat redux from Stark's might be at the top of the list...since it is already in effect prior to any skills or other item redux procs.
the things you can assume are:
-all reduction is in effect before penetration is considered.
-flat penetration occurs before %-based penetration.

you cannot assume that all %-based reduction occurs before flat reduction.


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GeminiTroll

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Senior Member

10-27-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by ricklessabandon View Post
the things you can assume are:
-all reduction is in effect before penetration is considered.
-flat penetration occurs before %-based penetration.

you cannot assume that all %-based reduction occurs before flat reduction.
Can you tell us how it works so we don't have to assume anything?


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MajorX17

Senior Member

10-27-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeminiTroll View Post
Can you tell us how it works so we don't have to assume anything?
Pretty sure it's just the order that they're applied.

If somebody with 100 MR steps onto Nidalee's trap, then gets in range of an enemy with an Abyssal Scepter, they would first lose 40%, then 20 flat MR, putting them at 40 MR.

However, if they were already in range of the Abyssal Scepter and then they walked onto Nidalee's trap, they would first lose 20 flat MR, then 40%, putting them at 48 MR.


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DreamsOfGrandeur

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Senior Member

10-27-2011

Depends on enemy comp.

Usually, flat pen is better, but if you're a melee-caster vs plenty of armor, then % can be more effective, a lot more.


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