Dominion sympathizes for losing teams. Rubberbanding, artificial "close games", etc.

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AstaorthX

Senior Member

10-12-2011

The only thing that changes is the respawn times go down for the losing team. easy way to avoid that? after killing them...base quick and come back out...problem solved. Also dont get over zealous and try 5 capping just cuz you have a 400 point lead...that just leads to dying, you being dead for 45 seconds and giving them an opening to cap nodes. If you are smart and just defend your nodes and neutralize theirs you will win just as easily without losing your lead.


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Krshna

Senior Member

10-12-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Necks View Post
When my team is leading with 400+ points and the enemy has less than 100, I know that the match will not end so easily. The rubberband mechanics of Dominion will favor the losing team and postpone the match until it becomes artificially "a close game". My team will win with ~50 points left or so.

No matter how much effort you put into having that 400+ point lead, no matter how hard you fought for that advantage, the Dominion system will artificially create this long, drawn out illusion that the losing team can still win. It bothers me because it's the system that induces the artificial "close game". It's not the enemy team that's shaping up and getting better with player skill. It's the system feeding gold to the losing team, stopping the loss of Nexus points by champion deaths, modification of respawn timers, etc.

Anyone else bothered by the artificial feeling of "a close match" that the game induces? For me, it waters down the game. Victories don't feel rewarding because I know that 50% of my effort was spent combating the game system and not the enemy team's players. "Close matches" don't feel like player skill is deciding victories; rather, the system's aid for losing teams feels like a huge factor.
Uh... can you please elaborate on this "system" it uses to bring losing teams back? I can barely count the number of times I have beat an enemy team 400 to 0.

You realize that the losing team doesn't get any kind of special tool or bonus if they are down. Everyone is always working with the exact same possibilities. The game mode itself is just easy to come back in, because all you have to do is capture more points. If you are at 1 point, but then you capture and hold 3 points for the rest of the game, you will win.

But there is no "system", the game isn't rigging the odds in favor of the losing team. You are completely and totally wrong.


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Yagidy

Senior Member

10-12-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krshna View Post
Uh... can you please elaborate on this "system" it uses to bring losing teams back? I can barely count the number of times I have beat an enemy team 400 to 0.

You realize that the losing team doesn't get any kind of special tool or bonus if they are down. Everyone is always working with the exact same possibilities. The game mode itself is just easy to come back in, because all you have to do is capture more points. If you are at 1 point, but then you capture and hold 3 points for the rest of the game, you will win.

But there is no "system", the game isn't rigging the odds in favor of the losing team. You are completely and totally wrong.
If your team is ahead in nexus points and you and your opponent trade deaths he will respawn before you, because the losing team has lower rez timers then the leading team. That is what this thread is about.

Also, your welcome.

Also also, pls fact check before posting so you don't sound tarded.


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Necks

Senior Member

10-12-2011

If the enemy Nexus gets to 100 points, champion deaths no longer reduce the Nexus points. So, if my team is ahead by 400 points and the enemy team gets to less than 100, the effectiveness of killing the enemy players will be significantly reduced.


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Ansre

Senior Member

10-12-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Necks View Post
When my team is leading with 400+ points and the enemy has less than 100, I know that the match will not end so easily. The rubberband mechanics of Dominion will favor the losing team and postpone the match until it becomes artificially "a close game". My team will win with ~50 points left or so.
That sucks for you.

I haven't really seen it happen. I've won several times with 350+ points left, though I don't recall ever winning with 400+ yet (upper 390s highest lifetime).


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Necks

Senior Member

10-12-2011

And yes the respawn timer changes for the winning and losing teams. The difference also depends on how far behind the losing team is.


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Seņor Pancho

Senior Member

10-12-2011

Quote:
And yes the respawn timer changes for the winning and losing teams. The difference also depends on how far behind the losing team is.
you are over estimating the consequences of that system. it will help the losing team get back on track, sure, but if they manage to actually take the lead, then the same system will now help you to comeback and secure the win.

if you are leading by 400 points, and you lose, don't blame the system... it used to be borderline dumb before this patch, now it works just fine. the respawn timer range isnt that wide anymore.

also, without these rules, the team with more early-mid game champions would have an unfair advantage.


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Necks

Senior Member

10-13-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seņor Pancho View Post

also, without these rules, the team with more early-mid game champions would have an unfair advantage.
But it's okay for champions made for late-game? This is the same reason why champions like Akali and Jax are 100% perma bans.

It's not okay for strong early game champions to have an advantage, but it's okay for strong late game champions to absolutely crush everyone?


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Brackhar

Features Designer

10-13-2011
1 of 5 Riot Posts

To be clear, these systems aren't actually intended to be "catch-up" mechanics, and if they've fallen too far on that side of things then we need to ratchet them back. What they are intended to do is counter-balance some of the design implications of making a very small sized map. When making Dominion we quickly found that attritional style gameplay, the need to go back to base and the travel time associated with reaching a point again, was a very important factor to allowing back and forth gameplay from both teams. You see this on Summoner's Rift when you look at how champions move and react to one another as people die and fights are resolved. At the same time we also found that a small map was needed to have the battles be engaging and to get the proper mixture of allowing for back caps while also giving people time to respond.

By shrinking the map size we reduced the attritional gameplay that's core to the game balance, and so we needed to think of another way to create that sense of "travel time" that allows for a good back and forth. Adjusting the respawn timers seemed the best way to create this type of gameplay. We considered basing the adjustments off of the number of points a team controlled at any given time, but we scrapped that idea as it then felt punishing to ever get more than 3 points and led to stale gameplay. Basing it off of the aggregate score was less penalizing tactically and overall a better experience.

As an analogy to SR, think of it like the respawn adjustments are simulating how far into enemy territory your 5-man group is running. The closer to the enemy base you are the more likely you are to win the game, but the more punishing dying can be in terms of letting the opposing team rebound.

This is a main area of our design focus right now to tune this properly as I agree it's a very sensitive subject, and the more feedback that you guys can give us over the coming patches will help us guide it in the right way. Definitely expect continual changes on this topic.


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JoeDuo

Senior Member

10-13-2011

Did you consider disabling the bonus/penality while the team that's behind in Nexus health is ahead in point controlled?
It's very bad when one team has 3-5 points yet much shorter respawn times, it causes the exact opposite of what the system is supposed to create.