fix Zilean already

First Riot Post
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Twisted

Senior Member

08-13-2009

NERf paladins!!!!!................ Wait what game is this?????

While we are at it lets nerf "QQ"


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cwatz

Adjudicator

08-13-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garak View Post
It's not a bug. There are patch notes in the Announcements forum that clearly state that Recall can affect itself. I take this as design intent.
I figured that was the case. One way or another they could always have it effect itself and just adjust the cd. Its a pretty minor thing to gripe about. The problems allllll in the ulti.


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Zileas

VP of Game Design

08-13-2009
1 of 1 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by muusbolla View Post
I'm so sick of having to deal with Zilean casting bomb and speed every 2 seconds and ult every ~16. He's so damn broken. Whyyyyyy does Recall affect itself? There's just no reason for this.

great, I love it when legit balance threads get derailed. Go to hell, trolls.
we are nudging up the CD a bit at some point in the next month -- not sure when it gets into the patch.


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The Senate

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Senior Member

08-13-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZileasAKATcadwell View Post
we are nudging up the CD a bit at some point in the next month -- not sure when it gets into the patch.
while you're at it, you should make time bomb draw tower aggro. if zilean didn't have enough going for him as it was.


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Victory

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Adjudicator

08-13-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by EnfEnEt View Post
Zilean dies fast if you have disables, silences, or a damaging enough spell to kill him before he can get his ultimate off. So just have a chogath, morgana, veigar, or kassidan on your team to counter him. If you get a wit's end and focus on him he'll have no mana after trying to use his ultimate twice.

Even if you don't have any counters, imagine Zilean's ultimate like Cryo's passive. Just keep focusing on him and he'll die.
Picking champions to counter him is a pretty silly solution seeing as the only game mode we have right now is blind pick. If cryophoenix could turn into an egg three times a minute, and all of the other people on cryophoenixes team could do it as well, your comparison would be apt. Recall affecting itself along with stacked -cooldown gear/runes/masteries truly does make this champion appear to be fundamentally broken in design.


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Zan

The Council

08-13-2009

ok... I have a small suggestion then.

Just make it so Recall does not affect itself *but* lower Recall's cooldown to whatever it is after it normally cools itself down currently (different for each rank etc).

This does 2 main things:

1. Its much more clear this way. Its currently confusing to new players since its not obvious that it would cool itself down. To give a Magic: The Gathering example, they used to print cards with creatures that had text like "All creatures get +1/+1", and the creature itself would be like a 1/1. Well, in actuality, the creature is a 2/2 because its own bonus applied to itself.

They realized this was unnecessary and confusing, so they now print creatures like the one above to say "All other creatures get +1/+1" and just make the guy a 2/2 on the card. Thats basically what im suggesting here.

2. There is also a secret bonus that seems unnecessary with recall cooling itself down. If you get cooldown reducing effects (items, glyphs, etc), it reduces the base cooldown of the spell even though its cooldown is actually much shorter... If the actual cooldown was just the current cooldown minus the effect, it would solve this.


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Faeorn Ran

Senior Member

08-13-2009

You know what I think would be cool? Changing his ulti to work like Nerubian Weaver, only targetable. Instead of rezzing a person when they hit zero, it teleports them back 6 seconds in time and heals them a little. This would be a lot less useful than his current ultimate, but could potentially be better. Would make the stakes much wilder.

It would be awesome.


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765Immortal

Senior Member

08-18-2009

I think his ultimate should have a low duration. Maybe 5 seconds. When a champion has Zil's utlimate, they are going to die soon anyways. Making the duration lower makes his ultimate more specific to "I know I'm going to die from this next spell or burst of DPS" occassions, instead of allowing Zilean to give a teammate 15 seconds more to live -- given your team doesn't focus the guy with Zilean's ultimate. I always try to wait until his Zil's ultimate wears off and focus some squishy instead.


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Bubbs

Senior Member

08-18-2009

Just make his ult not affected by recall and it's balanced.


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Vangu

Senior Member

08-18-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Senate View Post
while you're at it, you should make time bomb draw tower aggro. if zilean didn't have enough going for him as it was.
Time bomb does draw aggro but Zilean has to still be in range once it goes off. You are not hurt once the bomb is on you only when it goes off and this is what draws the attention. And I hope no one is dumb enough to still be in range once that bomb goes off >.>

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubbs View Post
Just make his ult not affected by recall and it's balanced.
I think bumping up recalls cd is enough to balance this out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZileasAKATcadwell View Post
we are nudging up the CD a bit at some point in the next month -- not sure when it gets into the patch.
I just hope you dont make the only champion I enjoy playing a wreck....
I say this because without the ability to use recall to cast time bomb and time warp we are without a decent damage ability for a while. Our time bomb does at most 500-600 damage end game and this is nothing compared to other classes like Teemo, Ashe, Twitch...etc where they can easily get 500+ damage per auto attack. If recall if nerfed any we will actually be waiting (as zilean) for a good 3+ seconds were we can do nothing ..and are auto attack is a laugh in battle. We use recall simply because we have to in order to do anything. Maybe lower the cooldown on time warp and time bomb and increase it on recall (I assume the main problem with recall is because it effects itself and a little to much on chronoshift) so just make recall not effect itself and lower recalls cooldown to 5-10 secs and make it still effect ulti. That would balance out the constint use of recall as it would no longer be a 2 sec cooldown and would make chronoshift non spammable.

Edit; I literally just walked into my brothers room (Xeirus) and just saw an Ashe do two side-by-side 1,3** auto attack (didn't get to see last two numbers) damage crits totally demolishing a player....