Summoner's Rift Map Design feedback

First Riot Post
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daft inquisitor

Senior Member

04-03-2014

Honestly, it just feels like Blue has such a huge advantage in so many ways. Better visibility, easier access to Dragon (via easily-flashable walls) and Baron (due to the entrance facing), the buffs feel more defensible, etc.

And I know you guys see that in your metrics. The data you use and show us tells us you KNOW Blue has a huge advantage. That's why the team with the higher average MMR gets purple side, that's why numbers are stilted slightly the way they are... but small boosts and such aren't going to fix it in the long run.

I hope you guys figure out a proper way to balance it, and soon. This is truly the single biggest thing I want out of the game right now.


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Kiech Bepho

Senior Member

04-03-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by daft inquisitor View Post
And I know you guys see that in your metrics. The data you use and show us tells us you KNOW Blue has a huge advantage. That's why the team with the higher average MMR gets purple side, that's why numbers are stilted slightly the way they are... but small boosts and such aren't going to fix it in the long run.

I hope you guys figure out a proper way to balance it, and soon. This is truly the single biggest thing I want out of the game right now.
If this is something you want to do, you could just flip the camera angle for players on Purple team. Of course the lanes would likely be renamed "Dragon" and "Baron" since "Bot" and "Top" would have no meaning anymore

Another neat idea is being discussed on GD, where the camera stays locked on the area between your champion and the mouse. There are a few sample videos and it looks really nice.

http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com....php?t=4402048


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synistermotive

Junior Member

04-03-2014

wild thoughts here but maybe just maybe you guys could do a massive rework of this map thats old as dirt? its just out of date feeling and the jungle and lanes as they are now are confusing to new players to say the least. rotate the map. just because it may lose some of the "feel" of SR who cares its had its run give us a better map. it would overall just freshen the game up imo. but ya know i dont design games but as a player for once rito just be drastic blow our minds with something different instead of modifying the same over and over. CHANGE IS OK IN THIS GAME


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RiotForScience

Senior Environment Artist

04-03-2014
5 of 11 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiech Bepho View Post
If this is something you want to do, you could just flip the camera angle for players on Purple team. Of course the lanes would likely be renamed "Dragon" and "Baron" since "Bot" and "Top" would have no meaning anymore

Another neat idea is being discussed on GD, where the camera stays locked on the area between your champion and the mouse. There are a few sample videos and it looks really nice.

http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com....php?t=4402048

That is a dreamy camera. Great ideas here!


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daft inquisitor

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiech Bepho View Post
If this is something you want to do, you could just flip the camera angle for players on Purple team. Of course the lanes would likely be renamed "Dragon" and "Baron" since "Bot" and "Top" would have no meaning anymore

Another neat idea is being discussed on GD, where the camera stays locked on the area between your champion and the mouse. There are a few sample videos and it looks really nice.

http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com....php?t=4402048
If that's LoLCam, I've used it before. And while I like the idea of it, it was way too much effort to try and figure out how to adjust the weighting to function how I wanted it to. Great in theory, mediocre in execution. I love the effort that's put into it, however.


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Lammah

Senior Member

04-04-2014

flip the map 45 degree to the right => less blue advantage over red


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synistermotive

Junior Member

04-04-2014

and then the thread slowly dies and my hopes of a SR rework fade for another 4 years


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RiotForScience

Senior Environment Artist

04-09-2014
6 of 11 Riot Posts

I have heard the feedback about rotating the map 45 degrees a good bit and think it is a fine idea in principle. As an exercise assume that our maps need to be square. How would you reconfigure the map islands and camps to accommodate this?


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Whoa There Betsy

Senior Member

04-09-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotForScience View Post
I have heard the feedback about rotating the map 45 degrees a good bit and think it is a fine idea in principle. As an exercise assume that our maps need to be square. How would you reconfigure the map islands and camps to accommodate this?
If the people who suggested this idea tried to play with their camera unlocked they would realize how much easier their time on purple side would be. They also don't understand the amount of work that would have to be put in to actually make SR look correct when flipped 45 degrees. It is simply too much effort for a problem that players can fix themselves.


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daft inquisitor

Senior Member

04-09-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotForScience View Post
I have heard the feedback about rotating the map 45 degrees a good bit and think it is a fine idea in principle. As an exercise assume that our maps need to be square. How would you reconfigure the map islands and camps to accommodate this?
Rotate everything around them. Maybe I'm not thinking through it completely, but I don't see a reason for the camps (especially buff camps) to be messed with at all. Maybe increase the spacing *slightly* in the jungle pathways to accommodate.

If it's an issue with the sizing/spacing, configure the jungle areas into triangular wedges. Use three-point metrics to design everything to fit together.

(Each camp encompasses a "triangle" shape, which fits together with the other jungle parts/pathways which are also triangles, until it fits into the giant square-shaped map, with each jungle zone taking slightly less than a quarter of the map to accommodate proper lanes/river.)

Hmm. Maybe I'll spend some time after work today putting this to a pic so it's easier to see it all fit together...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whoa There Betsy View Post
If the people who suggested this idea tried to play with their camera unlocked they would realize how much easier their time on purple side would be. They also don't understand the amount of work that would have to be put in to actually make SR look correct when flipped 45 degrees. It is simply too much effort for a problem that players can fix themselves.
This statement is an oversimplification from the player perspective. Just because you find it easy to use an unlocked camera, it doesn't mean everyone does or can. Some people (myself included) cannot use the unlocked camera, and I've spent days trying to adjust to it.

My problem with it is relative direction. In order for me to think about where my spells go, where enemies spells are going, how I'm moving, etc., my character has to be in the center of the camera, or I can't properly work everything. I miss skillshots, I don't click where I intend to, it screws with my Flash (because it goes in the direction of your cursor, and my cursor is never in the proper relative direction to myself when playing with an unlocked camera), etc.

Your statement is basically saying, "A small amount of the population is colorblind and it's causing them issues with them seeing the game correctly. They should probably just learn to adapt to the more subtle colors. Don't bother having Riot try to fix it just because it's something people can fix on their own."

(Yes, I know this issue is not as major of an issue as colorblindness, but it IS an issue that some of us have, and it affects our gameplay greatly. And yes I understand it's more work to completely change a map than to adjust some colors, but enough of the player base WANTS the adjustments to the map to make it even, so I think Riot should at least hear us out with our ideas, even if it isn't feasible for them to go anywhere.)