Rengar Thread of Bolas and Roaring

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Ololoshev

Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
To be clear about Rengar's role in a team, we wanted to leave this mostly unchanged. He is still the guy that hunts the enemy squishies and can stalk around choosing his prey at will. His damage is lowered some, but we still want him to be a strong damage threat.

He is unique from some of the other assassins like zed or khazix because he has much more versatility with his ferocity skills (CC, Damage, Heals, many options here). On the other hand, some other assassins have escapes, where he does not. Considering he doesn't have a reliable escape once he has engaged, we gave him some more tools like durability and speed so that once he is in, he has a means of contributing.

As far as items, we're not designing towards any "right" way to build Rengar. He scales well with both offensive and defensive items and that is something that is cool about him as a character.

Keep in mind, we're not going to leave Rengar out to dry if he has problems/needs changes. We already have a bunch of changes planned for the next patch like speeding up the Q attack animations significantly, and some ult warning changes that we have been talking about in this thread. We should have a bunch more data soon, which will help inform us if he needs more changes, and where.

I appreciate all of the feedback, and I know that change can be frustrating on a character that you know and love so well. Don't fear for Rengar, he's not going away anytime soon.
For assasin "to contribute" means to kill his target, and now you made Rengar unable to kill people before it's about late game. He loses almost every top lane matchup, E change made him even more susceptible to ranged/high sustain champions. He is bad at bursty trades, he is bad at prolonged trades, he is bad at shoving the lane, he is bad at pushing tower. Rengar didn't dominate top lane before, now his laning is even worse.


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TwinkiesCB

Junior Member

04-05-2014

@RiotScruffy
Thank you for continuing to give feedback and commenting on the thread. I know you said he is a different kind of assasssin because he has no escape but isn't an "assassin" someone who kills then escapes? Calling him "a different kind of assassin" just sounds like he is a bruiser because the MS and tankiness from his W suggests it. I recommend that if Rengar is going to stay an assassin he needs an escape but if you don't want to give him an escape then atleast buff the time he has increased MS after his ultimate or increase the MS boost % because it fills lackluster and i've found myself be completely stopped by a few slows then dying shortly after. Please continue to keep us updated and informed, and share any news and ideas you guys have planned for him in detail so we as a community can give appropriate feedback and impressions. Thank you.


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Meet Sacred

Junior Member

04-05-2014

His Q is my main issue and I didn't realize that his ult doesn't stack up is fer anymore. I won't be playing him anytime soon.


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Stanleyyyyyy

Senior Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by hashinshin View Post
Why even remove Q +Auto from brush?

So many champions can chain abilities and autos together, and now not rengar?

Anyone with a reset can AA + reset.

Trynd can AA + spin.

Anyone with an AoE (Darius, Zed, etc.) Can AA + AoE.

Riven can beat her face in the keyboard.

But Rengar isn't allowed to Q + auto?
I beleive after the next patch he should be able to q auto or bush jump + Q.


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bossmann1313

Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
To be clear about Rengar's role in a team, we wanted to leave this mostly unchanged. He is still the guy that hunts the enemy squishies and can stalk around choosing his prey at will. His damage is lowered some, but we still want him to be a strong damage threat.
His damage is lowered a lot more than just "some". You said before that its 100% fine if someone has a lot of damage but you can counter play (ex zed). Before rengar had a lot of damage but no counter play. Now he has counter play and little damage. This needs to be fixed

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
He is unique from some of the other assassins like zed or khazix because he has much more versatility with his ferocity skills (CC, Damage, Heals, many options here). On the other hand, some other assassins have escapes, where he does not. Considering he doesn't have a reliable escape once he has engaged, we gave him some more tools like durability and speed so that once he is in, he has a means of contributing.
Great this is the point of his w. That's fine

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
As far as items, we're not designing towards any "right" way to build Rengar. He scales well with both offensive and defensive items and that is something that is cool about him as a character.
No. He's an assassin. Make him one. His w if supposed to give him enough tankiness to survive during his 1.5 seconds of bursting down a carry. We would rather have a really strong assassin, than a sub-par assassin, and a sub-par bruiser, and a sub-par tank.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
Keep in mind, we're not going to leave Rengar out to dry if he has problems/needs changes. We already have a bunch of changes planned for the next patch like speeding up the Q attack animations significantly, and some ult warning changes that we have been talking about in this thread. We should have a bunch more data soon, which will help inform us if he needs more changes, and where.
If you don't want to leave Rengar out to dry listen to us. We wanted an assassin, you gave us a bruiser. We responded, no this rework is bad, change him back to an assassin. Now's your chance to change him back to an assassin. I posted earlier an entire summary of what they community is basically trying to say. Listen to us please.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
I appreciate all of the feedback, and I know that change can be frustrating on a character that you know and love so well. Don't fear for Rengar, he's not going away anytime soon.
Change is frustrating if it is unexpected. You said we'll keep him an assassin and remove some of the toxic game play, and compensate for it. Instead you removed all his strengths and gave almost nothing in return. Please just listen to what we are saying and change him accordingly. Thank you.


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Rengarbage

Junior Member

04-05-2014

Hello everyone,
I was wondering if anyone could answer the following question about old Rengar:

Did Rengar's Q previously add to an auto attack (i.e. AA + Q dmg) or simply modify the damage (i.e. no AA but Q dmg)?


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bossmann1313

Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rengarbage View Post
Hello everyone,
I was wondering if anyone could answer the following question about old Rengar:

Did Rengar's Q previously add to an auto attack (i.e. AA + Q dmg) or simply modify the damage (i.e. no AA but Q dmg)?
"The next basic attack within 2 seconds deals 30/60/90/120/150 (+1.0 AD) physics damage."

It is an auto attack modifier. Your auto attack damage doesn not get added on to your q damage.

It is 100% of you AD plus the base damage of q. I hope this helps


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Desperato911

Junior Member

04-05-2014

As the leap q combo is an essential part of rengar's kit, both in jungle and laning, this is a huge issue that needs a hotfix. If the speed up to his q can happen quicker, I think we might get to a point where we can constructively critique the new rengar. As it stands now, he's clunky and his leap q combo bug is critically adversely affecting my ability to play rengar jungle.

HOTFIX PREEZE.


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Trading Aces

Senior Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ololoshev View Post
For assasin "to contribute" means to kill his target, and now you made Rengar unable to kill people before it's about late game. He loses almost every top lane matchup, E change made him even more susceptible to ranged/high sustain champions. He is bad at bursty trades, he is bad at prolonged trades, he is bad at shoving the lane, he is bad at pushing tower. Rengar didn't dominate top lane before, now his laning is even worse.
and to top it all, his e has a tiny hit box and at an abysmal speed.


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RiotScruffy

Game Designer

04-05-2014
17 of 21 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by hashinshin View Post
Why even remove Q +Auto from brush?

So many champions can chain abilities and autos together, and now not rengar?

Anyone with a reset can AA + reset.

Trynd can AA + spin.

Anyone with an AoE (Darius, Zed, etc.) Can AA + AoE.

Riven can beat her face in the keyboard.

But Rengar isn't allowed to Q + auto?

The Q from brush will be working better after our next set of changes as well. Also Q does currently and will still reset his auto attack.