Rengar Thread of Bolas and Roaring

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DancerofWar

Senior Member

04-04-2014

I have yet to play the rework, so I wont comment on that.

What I will say is that everyone raging, your not helping ANYTHING!!

Post what you like and dislike. Try and go into detail. If you don't have time to type out a respectable statement then quote something that covers how you feel and put a small, non insulting comment at the end.

I haven't liked most of Riots reworks(old Karma main/hipster here), but raging will only make them ignore you and leave Rengar in your trash bin of champs.


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P4ntz

Junior Member

04-04-2014

Hi Riot!

First time posting but as I normally main jungle and rengar has been pulling me through silver I wanted to post my opinion!

I actually really agree with a lot of the changes made, I think I am understanding more after the first few games with the changes where you guys are wanting to go with him my only suggestion is this,

change the ult back to generating ferocity while stealthed, not after. The thing I loved about rengar is that you could engage quickly onto an adc after team has initiated then as you are getting low flash away put on ult after burning all your charges and then at full charges enter into the team fight once again. I found this really made him a viable assassin in team fights and really set him apart in his playability. Also I dont know if its just me but the amount of times I found myself waiting for that 1 second build on ferocity after coming out of stealth took my attention away from my target as, for the first few times, I would mistime things and end up using a wrong empowered ability because of the incredibly fast stacking of ferocity.

Other than that I absolutely think that rengars damage puts him as a viable assassin and his sustain helps with the jungle and top lane roles. Thanks so much for all your hard work! Really appreciate it!

P4ntz


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Smoot

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Any news on RP refunds? I really don't want this champion in my list anymore.


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eatsgokuforlunch

Senior Member

04-04-2014

As they guy above pointed out the ferocity generation after committing leads to random empowered ability usage as it is very difficult to keep track of YOu know because you are in a herd of 3-5 champs during team fights....


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FlyingRainbowCat

Member

04-04-2014

I played rengar on URF mode
I dont feel he is powerful even in this OP mode


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Aggression

Senior Member

04-04-2014

@RiotScruffy

This is why Rengar is no longer fun to play.

As an assassin:
Rengar has lower burst damage than every other assassin, making him a useless pick.

Rengar now has to be compared to "high damage auto attack fighters" who have bursty skills:
Jax, Jarvan, Aatrox, Tanky Kha'zix, Udyr, etc. He barely out-duels any of them if they are even in gold. From my tests, he can't outburst J4, but wins if neither use their ult, he can't fight Udyr, Jax, Trundle, or Aatrox, and can kill Kha'zix if he does not use his ultimate to time-out rengar's ferocity Q.

Any champion, no matter how terrible, can always perform well in the right hands and with the right gold advantages, so you really can't use playtesting or any personal experiences in 'normal' games to judge. You have to see what happens if you have a slugfest in 'ideal conditions' for both champions.

As it is, I have yet to see an instance where I would ever choose to have Rengar in a situation over Jax, Trundle, or Aatrox. If Jarvan IV didn't use mana, he would be better hands down as well.


I think a great deal of this is because you toned down everything he had going for him as an assassin, citing each specific instance as "because he was toxic when ahead and useless when behind".

For example, right now, with his ult, it doesn't matter if you know he is coming or not. You do not need any reaction time against rengar. He cannot, and will not, burst down a target without time to react. Unless its someone running into a bush with 300 hp, in which case, what's the problem? Nocturne's ultimate can do the same thing, except it makes everything invisible instead of himself.

His Q attack speed and bonus damage on towers was a problem, so you made his Q give no attack speed and only marginal amounts when used with ferocity (stacking the Q ferocity Q and a third Q was what gave him such strong dps, so the ferocity Q right now will never come remotely close to the AS increase possible before). Then you also made his Q unusable on towers, which means it doesn't matter how strong it is in relation to hitting towers, since you can't use it. So all you did, was make Q extremely weak for killing champions and clearing the jungle.

I don't see much of a problem with the roar and bola changes, though I don't think either of them were an issue. Nobody built rengar with full damage and E max anymore, because you can just pick any current top laner and all-in him and win, because if he is maxing E he has zero dps in a face-smashing contest.


tl;dr you nerfed everything he had going for him for assassination and split-pushing which meant since all the nerfs stack on each other, he can't do any of those at all, because he basically got both roles nerfed twice via cross-effects. Meanwhile, there are still plenty of assassins who can come out of nowhere and instakill an adc with zero counterplay because they are ahead. Please remove zed's ultimate, the DFG item, kha'zix's leap, jarvan's ult and Q scalings, talon's entire kit, leblanc's W, and fizz's % missing damage, so keep things consistent.


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Elessar II

Senior Member

04-04-2014

In my opinion, here are 3 changes that would make Rengar feel a lot better without adding way too much power (especially with additional balancing touches)

1) Let q be an AA reset (like Poppy's q, which resets AA but doesn't proc on tower). I know that you guys tried to compensate it with giving q a lower cooldown and that you guys believe giving an AA reset gives him too much power, but right now the sluggish q is like 90% of why Rengar feels so clunky. At this point, I'd rather see nerfs on his q damage and cd if that meant having it reset his AA.

2) SPEED UP THE BOLA. The bola as a skillshot is pretty neat, and personally I really enjoy the skill/counterplay aspect of it. However, a 1000 range skillshot traveling at that speed is painfully easy to dodge, especially at higher elo games. Because it is Rengar's only source of cc, it is important for it to have a certain degree of reliability (like Elise's cocoon). At the moment, using empowered bola is too big a risk since it is so easy to dodge. In my opinion, the speed should be slightly slower than Elise's cocoon.

3) Make his ult alert globally. If you want to make it so that people can anticipate and prepare for Rengar's ganks, at least make it not reveal his location on the map. At high elo, you can abuse Rengar's current ult simply because it reveals where he is. If I see my top alerted, I would instantly call, "Hey guys, Rengar is top, let's go do drag, or let's invade here." An ult that offers the enemy a tactical advantage is pretty sad and doesn't feel good at all.


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Grey Verve

Member

04-04-2014

Rengar doesn't smash people in a second, he's tankier and he's now quite sticky. Overall safer to play in game and less...Shaco-like. I like.

Just need to smoothen out the Q animation and skill combos, some of the internal cooldowns and animation feels a bit clunky and I was confused why on Runeterra skills don't fire when Ferocity maxes out when I realize the Ferocity skills have, what, 0.2 sec prep time? It should be smoothen out.

Thanks for the gameplay update (GU?) guys! I'm gonna go master some Rengar now!


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009Deathwolf

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Can you make it such that when rengar is in a bush and he ults, the *!* sign shouldn't appear over enemies, because normally if he was in a bush and the enemy had no ward in that bush, they wouldn't know he was there and they would have to facecheck.
Riot pls.


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eatsgokuforlunch

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Come on reds come out of your DEN I need answers real answers not riot JAg's attitude

your rework is bugged and **** tier .... Show your self