@Riot: Progress Report on Gangplank

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Draktok

Senior Member

03-07-2014

just don't change his q

you can drop nerf remove all his other abilities but if you remove his q so help me god i'll drop myself from platinum to bronze playing gp


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Hacen

Junior Member

03-07-2014

Personally I like GP's versatility. ADC, AP Tank, and Support which is like the Tri-Force builds for GP. In another account I pretty much used GP till I reached Level 19 (Literally). After testing various builds I found the 1-Hit-Wonder GP amazing, I built 105% Crit-Chance (Extra 5%, you can never be too cautious) with Some Life Steal, Health or AP (ORANGES) for the sustain at the late game, It was hilarious watching people running away at the sight of me, I first hit E, then chase or BD and attack either with auto attack or Parrley. With Parrley I one shot pretty much everyone, tanks cower in fear. My team did not necessarily like me due to the fact that if I join a team fight the enemy dies in a couple hits and the fact that it is very similar to KS since they pet so much effort and I just shut em' down.

However this doesn't mean that he is OP, it means that the just did not have enough armour and/or a Thornmail. You can shut his early with a Pantheon or a Doran's Shield. To tell the truth GP is currently a husk of what he once was, and he need a rework that allows him have more DPS, Mobility and a different utility gained that what E provides

I also believe that GP should scale differently, since AD only affects Parrley & AP increases the worth of him as a support-tank or a champ that puts pressure during lane due to the sustain his Orange's provide.


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Critkeeper

Senior Member

03-07-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot GMang View Post
Hey all! Nice to see interest, thanks for bringing this up. I’ve been a bit of a lurker when it comes to forums—apologies for being so quiet about it!

Work on Gangplank is still in its formative stages. Gangplank is a cool character with some unique mechanical hooks in his identity, and I don’t want to rush him; currently, he has no timeline—more of a “when he’s ready” kind of situation. Right now, we’re analyzing and prototyping so we can formalize the right plan.

If you have thoughts on him, I’d love to hear them! What excites you about Gangplank, and what bores you? What frustrates, and what satisfies? What is he overdoing, and what is he missing? Inquiring minds want to know!
A pirate doesn't really feel like a pirate until he spills the blood of a landlover over a chest of gold.

Shouldn't a pirate be able to find a treasure chest somewhere? It would be cool if instead of getting bonus gold on his Q gangplank came across a pirates chest every once in a while, based on whatever factors arranged in such away that it functions kind of like thresh's souls, so that he can't just get lucky and find a bunch of chests or go for half the game and not find any.

I'm thinking it would still be granular enough to be a big "oh boi!" moment. Like, expect to find one chest every 2-3 minutes or so.

If you find a chest but the enemy is defending it, and there is a lot of "combat" that goes on in front of the chest, its contents will be worth more and more, based on whatever factors your balance team and programmers decide to put in.

Chests don't just "instantly appear"-- they like to appear in blind spots, round the bend in a corner for example. If both you and your enemy break sight with the chest, it will disappear after a certain amount of time and appear somewhere else. Maybe like 30 seconds. That would up the bounty on the next chest, but only just to keep you in line with where you should be assuming you had just picked up chests as soon as they spawned.

An enemy can set up a post to stop you from pick up the chest if they find it by putting down a sight ward on top of it so it won't disappear and respawn elsewhere.

You can clear that ward and deny them that denial.



Dat feels when u finally open it up.

you could experiment with putting other valuables in the chest aside from gold, like potions, boots if you don't have any.
Or if the chest's value has been driven particularly high, you could put something like a basic tier item in it. I don't know how you would implement that or the decision making procedures that decide which item gets picked, or how to keep the gangplank from feeling like his chest contained trash because he has to sell the item. Maybe you could make it a "gold" dagger or a "gold" brawlers gloves-- literally made of gold that function just the same and can be used all the same in recipes, but also sell for 100% of their value.


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Pro Anïvïa

Senior Member

03-07-2014

excites:
cashmoney
big crits
long range moneymaker
oranges
running fast

bores:
passive. its just a slow and a small dot, doesnt have a lot of gameplay other than "dont walk into melee range of GP or you'll die"
parley. i love the gold gain and the big late game crits, but the "point and click to damage enemy" thing is both boring to use and its frustrating to play against when its not nerfed to garbage like it is right now.



GP has a lot of elements that make him fun, but too much power is put into his passive and point and click harass.


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ForumAccount23

Senior Member

03-07-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot GMang View Post
Hey all! Nice to see interest, thanks for bringing this up. I’ve been a bit of a lurker when it comes to forums—apologies for being so quiet about it!

Work on Gangplank is still in its formative stages. Gangplank is a cool character with some unique mechanical hooks in his identity, and I don’t want to rush him; currently, he has no timeline—more of a “when he’s ready” kind of situation. Right now, we’re analyzing and prototyping so we can formalize the right plan.

If you have thoughts on him, I’d love to hear them! What excites you about Gangplank, and what bores you? What frustrates, and what satisfies? What is he overdoing, and what is he missing? Inquiring minds want to know!
Question: Why rework? If he needs buffs give him buffs. Whats the point of these reworks? Some people actually like the champion as he is. I dont understand riots obession with taking older champions and reworking them.


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Rikukun

Senior Member

03-07-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot GMang View Post
What excites you about Gangplank, and what bores you? What frustrates, and what satisfies? What is he overdoing, and what is he missing? Inquiring minds want to know!
I would say the most exciting thing about GP is the massive burst damage you can put out with his Q. It is really fun. Also ulting right on top of 5 enemies anywhere on the map is great.

E is probably the most boring ability, since it's just some free stats.

Hitting big with Q's, and surviving CC with W is really satisfying, though getting out of suppression might be overdoing.

I would say he is missing the ability to fight in any kind of meta where dashing is needed for melee damage, or being tanky is needed, because he just doesn't feel like he is doing his job when tanky, but he is squishy when built damagey and has trouble sticking to some (well, a lot) of targets.


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Arrevax

Senior Member

03-07-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot GMang View Post
Hey all! Nice to see interest, thanks for bringing this up. I’ve been a bit of a lurker when it comes to forums—apologies for being so quiet about it!

Work on Gangplank is still in its formative stages. Gangplank is a cool character with some unique mechanical hooks in his identity, and I don’t want to rush him; currently, he has no timeline—more of a “when he’s ready” kind of situation. Right now, we’re analyzing and prototyping so we can formalize the right plan.

If you have thoughts on him, I’d love to hear them! What excites you about Gangplank, and what bores you? What frustrates, and what satisfies? What is he overdoing, and what is he missing? Inquiring minds want to know!
Exciting:
Everything, really. Gangplank's passive's great for the little extra DPS and the soft slow that he needs to stick to his targets.
His Q is an amazing ability- I love using Statikk Shiv and Hydra as Gangplank because he can proc them at range- he doesn't get wrecked by poke before big fights because he brings some of his own. It's always fun to see GP blasting enemies over and over with his pistol (crit animation + Q)
Gangplank's W is necessary for him to stay alive in lane and in fights (he kinda explodes if he gets CC'd when his oranges are on cooldown). The oranges have also reached League memehood- people think of oranges when they think of Gangplank. The ability is iconic.
Gangplank's E is probably my least favorite part of his kit, but it adds to the versatility that the rest of his kit already provides. The passive movement speed is my favorite part of the ability- Gangplank is mobile MS-wise. However, his lack of a dash-type escape... Compare this ability to Flash in an emergency situation. Gangplank tends to be squishy- squishies prefer Flash. E is necessary for GP to have any semblance of mobility- his passive slow is not enough for him to stick to his target(s). The extra AD is always helpful. The active buff makes losing to a Gangplank's team in a fight very punishing- GP's team is guaranteed to take an objective or two using the extra teamwide tower/Baron/Dragon-taking power. The passive boost doesn't feel like invisible power because Gangplank is always assumed to be a quick character that does high damage (melee ADC)- he usually builds Zeal items, anyway.
Gangplank's ultimate is fun, fun, fun. Being able to help your team from anywhere is awesome, especially when GP is behind and needs to farm (often after he's lost his tower to a stronk bruiser that bullied him out of lane ). It can be used to catch fleeing enemies (with some vision/skill and luck) and is very helpful during teamfights. The only thing I dislike about the ability is the randomization of the cannonballs. That sort of randomness isn't very good for League, but it does fit right along with Gangplank's tendency to build crit, the Riot-sanctioned random factor.
No matter what I'm doing with Gangplank, I'm never bored. The constant option-weighing is thrilling, as is the constant critting and the dynamic power of GP's abilities. The fact that Gangplank can fill any role with some degree of competency excites me- he's like Nidalee, but without him being shoved into one powerful but controversial role (Nidalee's glass cannon AP spearspam build). I've used him in every position/role except primary ADC (he gets too much heat from the enemy ADC/support as such, and he runs out of mana using Q to farm and W to survive), and never felt unsatisfied by his performance.
Gangplank is a carry, to be sure. His early game is beyond weak. I did quit trying to support with him after the goldstealing utility mastery was removed- I might try again with the current version of the Frost Queen's Claim line, but AP GP needs quite a bit of farm to become strong (and he isn't as good for taking objectives as AD GP). Gangplank fails to sustain if he tries to be aggressive in his main role, toplane melee ADC- he gets forced to Q farm (his Q isn't good enough harass early on against most toplaners to warrant the cost), and if he ever takes damage, he has to waste W to survive (which also makes him more susceptible to ganks than most would think- his W is often down if he's forced to farm with his autos). He just can't get enough mana and health sustain to keep using those two abilities... And even if he did, he would have wasted a ton of gold on sustain instead of the high-damage items he needs during teamfights (and for splitpushing).
I do NOT want a Gangplank buff or full rework. He's already streamlined for winning late game, whether he has to splitpush or teamfight. His passive is probably being targeted right now because of the gradually increasing hostility towards permaslows, but consider what Gangplank is, what he does. Gangplank needs that slow+his own movespeed (passive and active) to engage and disengage without blowing his ultimate every time he wants to go in (which would defeat the purpose of it being global). His W is probably being targeted for it being a heal (= sustain) mechanic, but it's already a trap, being costly for Gangplank to keep using (and necessary for him to survive ganks and hard/non-permaslow engages). Honestly, I wouldn't mind seeing the power of Gangplank's E active shifted elsewhere (for example, letting Gangplank keep the passive bonuses, perhaps even boosting them a little to compensate, and giving him a new ability), but that is a massive drop in Gangplank's potential- his E is his only way to support his ADC as a support (besides harassing with Q) and taking its boost away would greatly weaken his overall potential (Gangplank's entire team would be missing out on a big boost that Gangplank had to survive the early game slog for).
The only change I can imagine Gangplank surviving without major issues (and anger from those of us that actually enjoy him as he is, plus the ridicule that could come with a bad rework, which would be likely given that Gangplank is a very defined character that isn't in a particularly bad place right now) is a de-randomization of Gangplanks' ultimate. Lower the overall damage of it, but make the cannonballs fall in a consistent, symmetrical fashion that both teams could rely on for play/counterplay.
Edit: I know Riot's opposed to lowering Gangplank's cast times, but having such a long one on a movement buff (Raise Morale) makes no sense. Perhaps Gangplank's R could be given a slightly longer cast time if his E had no cast time?


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Frayace

Senior Member

03-07-2014

The things that really define how many people play him right now is his Q. A ranged ability on a melee champ that triggers all on hit effects just feels good to use.

his ult is funny and all, and has it's uses, but... I would love to see it changed.

his E is good, but it's active feels so lackluster at the moment, especially since you have to stop in order to move faster.

I love his W, and it is incredibly strong. It is one of the things Gangplank is known for, but if changing it will put him in a more healthy state, then I'm all for it.

His passive, based on Riot's rework of Skarner, needs to go. His current passive is, "if I'm ahead of you in gold. I win." since it does not let the opponent easily escape.


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CrossXxodia

Senior Member

03-07-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot GMang View Post
If you have thoughts on him, I’d love to hear them! What excites you about Gangplank, and what bores you? What frustrates, and what satisfies? What is he overdoing, and what is he missing? Inquiring minds want to know!
Excitement:
-Pirate
-Cutlass
-Gun
-Criticals
-Lightning (statikk shiv)
-Oranges
-it's k

Boredom:
-Raise Morale (it's just a stats button, there's nothing remotely interesting about it)

Frustration:
-RNG ultimate
-Attack Speed is ABYSMALLY slow for a melee damage dealer
-Q and E Mana costs (Q needs its mana cost reverted to 40-60 from 50-70, E needs its mana cost lowered to 30 at all ranks from 50-70 given how heavily cooldown-gated the move already is)

Satisfies:
-Move speed. This mother****er is FAST. As in "almost no point in running Ghost on him" fast.

Overdoing:
-Q is an incredibly overloaded skill (1.0 AD +120 damage, can crit, applies on-hits, ranged, additional gold gain, last hit mana-refund; in a word, it does a lot, and it's easy to see that his other skills suffer for it; that said, it is a signature ability and I'd hate to see it go)

Missing:
-He's a melee damage dealer without much of a reason to get in melee range; he has no inherent defenses in a fight outside of a single 360 heal, and what offensive power he does have pales in comparison to say, Master Yi's Highlander or Yasuo's Doublecrit.

SUMMARY:
-Rework Cannon Barrage to give some form of consistency. This is THE #1 priority. If it has to lose global range to do so, so be it.

-Give him a brand new spell in place of Raise Morale, or rework it, or lower its mana cost to 30 at all ranks

-Consider lowering Q's mana cost very slightly, or buffing his mana pool

-Do not TOUCH W. It is perfect.


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Guardman

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Senior Member

03-07-2014

What I like about GP:

1. I love GP's Q. Everything about it is what makes play GP worth it. Not only can he deal massive damage with it via critical striking, but it also applies on hit effects, which allow things like Hydra or Iceborn Gauntlet to be very effective on him depending on you needs. Also because it gives bonus gold it is really rewarding to use it to farm. And because of Lichbane it allows for AP GP which is always fun.

2. Oranges. Really this is one of the best heal/utility spells in the game and has the high moments of really feeling its effect (especially the CC removal) that you just don't get with the other heals. It is also nice because it can be baited, reducing its power level a bit and introduces counterplay.

3. His ultimate is great for saving towers or adding pressure in a teamfight even while you are across the map.

4. You are a pirate.


What I don't enjoy as much about GP.

1. His E, while powerful is not very satisfying. I would prefer it just be scrapped and replaced with something else.

2. His passive is something that probably should be changed as well as while noticeable it is not that satisying. Plus it is a passive that encourages you to be able to get in close and auto attack, while his most satisfying gameplay pattern is via using his Q to poke.

3. His ult feels a little too random at times. I could get a perfectly placed ult off, but due to some bad luck it barely deals any damage. I would like to see some more consistency in his ult so that its effectiveness doesn't just come down to luck.