Why LSI Lolnexus Lolking etc. are bad for League

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Exvayate

Senior Member

02-28-2014

Casual game with someone being a total @ss through the use of LoLNexus:

Support: "GG our Lucian has AP runes on. Lost lane already."


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Riot Reboot

Business Intelligence Manager

02-28-2014
1 of 2 Riot Posts

It's an interesting question, worth breaking into two parts.
1) Do these sites, on average, materially alter gameplay?
2) If so, is the difference, on average, negative for the majority of the player base?

Based on the OP's anecdotes, 1 would be a big yes and 2 is assumed to be a yes as well. I imagine there's two things (among many) we should consider when trying to figure out if those anecdotes are valid:

1) Is the inverse experience (i.e. successfully adjusting your gameplay strat based on perceived threats/weaknesses described on a third party site) a better or worse experience? My logic here is that something that imposes a challenge to one player should represent an opportunity to another, and these challenge-opportunity pairs should plentiful enough to comprise, on average, a sense of balance.

2) How big of an issue are we talking about? Are sites contributing to a bad experience every single game, at every single tier, or are we talking about an isolated portion of the population, or something in between? My logic here is that if it's a small portion of the population having a negative experience, we may think about it differently than if it's a massive issue.

It might be worthwhile to dig into some publicly available data - I'm interested in seeing what people come up with.


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Splitpushing

Senior Member

02-28-2014

1st after red


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Thryale

Senior Member

02-28-2014

The main problem with using these sites is not everyone uses them. Therefore those that don't use them are at a disadvantage compared to those that do. And seeing as it is a third party thing, I don't believe it is fair to require players to use these sites just to level the playing field.


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Kholdstare13

Senior Member

02-28-2014

I use quickfind. It is the only metric left available to us that allows me to estimate my elo and track my progress. The beta view also gives more detailed personal stats from my match history so I don't need to screencap my end-game grid to review exactly how effective I was with a certain build.

Then there is the issue of seeing who is in a premade. If you get solo teamed with a 4-man, being able to see that and know for sure makes it so much easier to endure if they decide to taunt you throughout the game. You know they're just poking fun when you can see that they are all together.

Premade viewing can also be a positive game changer, letting you know where to focus your attention. Premades are more likely to respond faster and be more dedicated to assisting each other, so focusing on taking down solos from among otherwise equal-priority targets often does lead to successful fights.

Rune prediction can also make it easier to talk strategy with your team. People usually never listen, but when they do that's when wins happen. Ezreal, Tristana, Kog'Maw, any champion that can focus AD or AP can be predicted from base instead of checking to see if they are showing more AP than their starting items once they come out of fog. That time before the teams meet is the biggest span you will have to type out strategy (if league had voice chat it would be easier without this) and knowing to focus on building a certain resistance while focusing burst on the outlier in damage type (when you get teammates who are willing to listen and not "it's just [mode]" *******s) wins games.

Those are my only experiences with these sites. Either positive with a friendly and responsive team, or neutral with selfish jerks who would never cooperate under any circumstances anyway.


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Just Mid

Member

02-28-2014

There's no advantage or disadvantage with these sites imo lol

The only problem they could have would be people looking each other up and bashing them for their match history or trolling them out of a promotional series.


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Millea

Senior Member

02-28-2014

Quote:
2) How big of an issue are we talking about? Are sites contributing to a bad experience every single game, at every single tier, or are we talking about an isolated portion of the population, or something in between? My logic here is that if it's a small portion of the population having a negative experience, we may think about it differently than if it's a massive issue.
I'd say in about 1/8 of normal games I play, I get harassed heavily during the game because i'm platinum and not carrying. I'm probably an outlier as i specialize in specific champions (Mid lane champs mostly) and am horrible at other types (such as adcs and tops). The friends that I generally play with are also lower tier, and in a majority of those games the other team usually comments. I find all of this really irritating and would be glad to have it removed.


What i do believe should be made available through the client is information on enemy runes and masteries as that is only available on those websites and that knowledge provides a clear advantage.


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TaIont

Senior Member

02-28-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thryale View Post
The main problem with using these sites is not everyone uses them. Therefore those that don't use them are at a disadvantage compared to those that do. And seeing as it is a third party thing, I don't believe it is fair to require players to use these sites just to level the playing field.
Thats not a problem the sites have no real effect on what happens in game. Math can tell you most of what the site tells you about their runes and masteries. Me knowing im facing a diamond player helps me a ton. I dont see how it hinders him to not know im silver.


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KuraiDesu

Junior Member

02-28-2014

In my experiences with using sites like lolking and lolnexus, whether I tell myself I'll play safer or whatnot, I end up not playing much different at all. Even if I'm playing someone way better than me, I'm not going to let that alter how I play my game. I always just tell myself to "play safer" like I always should be doing, because I know that I have poor map awareness.

I once played a blind game where I mirrored top as Riven. Their Riven was clearly better than me mechanically and had better lane control than I did, so I just played more cautiously. Even though I lost the lane, I was able to safely farm up, roam around, get kills, and became a relevant late game threat. My team ended up winning that game, and my friend, who was spectating, pointed out after the game ended that the Riven I laned against was diamond. I didn't know during the game, but afterward, all it did was make me go, "Oh, no wonder they were beating me." And I thought nothing else of it.


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Aerothal

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Senior Member

02-28-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot Reboot View Post
1) Do these sites, on average, materially alter gameplay?
2) If so, is the difference, on average, negative for the majority of the player base?
Thank you for taking the time to look into this. We appreciate it!

1) YES
2) YES

I fully agree with the OP that stats pages are a negative influence on the game.
You already recognized this and solved part of the problem by hiding the opposing teams summoner names. I remember season 2, i mained amumu and the opposing team banned him because i played him in 7 out of 10 games on my history.. you solved that.
I can still look up my own teams names and "distrust" them based on recent performance.
I wish you would just hide all summoner names in select.

Now to the team stats:
When you play a game and you want to win it, you can not afford to not look up your lane opponents runes and masteries.
And obviously one is going to adjust the early game build depending on the rune/mastery set up.
The OP is completely right.
I really wish you would step in and block this info for all data mining sites.
It is a huge difference to check out an opponents stats in game while stuff is going on and trying to decypher his setup by the ingame stats then to just lolnexus them and have it all presented on a silver platter with a little imaginary side note stating" hit me here because this is where i am weak"

tldr:
Remove summoner names from the own team to negate pre game discrimination/distrust.
Remove the broadcast of runes and masteries at all times.


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