Why the hell do people new to ranked start off with silver level MMR?

First Riot Post
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Varietoceraptor

Senior Member

02-08-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyndication View Post
not rare at all, just happened to me

exactly what the **** is this. my current game right now.

http://prntscr.com/2qv1js

so i got 2 new kids with under 20 games while the other team all has like 100+ games played

and this is the result all without even being ganked.

http://prntscr.com/2qv17l
Hey, guy.

You're silver 5 with like 250 games played. 'New kids' are probably better than you most the time.


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Cyndication

Senior Member

02-08-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Varietoceraptor View Post
Hey, guy.

You're silver 5 with like 250 games played. 'New kids' are probably better than you most the time.
The reason is because of **** like this. How can i win a game that my fate is decided champ select?


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Zileas

VP of Game Design

02-08-2014
3 of 4 Riot Posts

OK I talked to Lyte about this. He theorizes that in this case you are likely dealing with one of two situations:

1) The person in question actually did play ranked last season, and has real experience -- and for whatever reason was playing poorly this game.

2) OR -- if #1 is not the case -- OCE is a smaller server than NA/EUW/etc, and it's possible the guy in question was in the queue for too long trying to get a 'low games played' game, and got tossed into yours after waiting a long time.

Basically, MM does try to resist this, but there are cases where it wont.


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Cyndication

Senior Member

02-08-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zileas View Post
OK I talked to Lyte about this. He theorizes that in this case you are likely dealing with one of two situations:

1) The person in question actually did play ranked last season, and has real experience -- and for whatever reason was playing poorly this game.

2) OR -- if #1 is not the case -- OCE is a smaller server than NA/EUW/etc, and it's possible the guy in question was in the queue for too long trying to get a 'low games played' game, and got tossed into yours after waiting a long time.

Basically, MM does try to resist this, but there are cases where it wont.
If it is going to do that, then it is single handedly deciding the game right then and there and the players forced to play these matches should be compensated in some way, like maybe extremely low lp losses or loss forgiven, it is literally not fair that just because there wasn't any people of his own skillset he gets qued with higher elo players and ruins their games? Please look at my example and tell me how in any way i was supposed to have a chance at winning that game, it literally wasn't possible even if i was a god at the game.


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Nasuuna

Senior Member

02-08-2014

why are you talking to lyte at 1am zileas


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LVNsNASmurf

Senior Member

02-08-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zileas View Post
OK I talked to Lyte about this. He theorizes that in this case you are likely dealing with one of two situations:

1) The person in question actually did play ranked last season, and has real experience -- and for whatever reason was playing poorly this game.

2) OR -- if #1 is not the case -- OCE is a smaller server than NA/EUW/etc, and it's possible the guy in question was in the queue for too long trying to get a 'low games played' game, and got tossed into yours after waiting a long time.

Basically, MM does try to resist this, but there are cases where it wont.
Thanks for your feedback man. I looked into #1, and it's very unlikely to be the case, as I see no indication of any previous ranked play.

#2 is a lot more likely. I've had some later at night (~9-12pm NZ time) games where I've been matched with the same few people a couple of games in a row. It does have a bit of a small server feel at times.

It's good to hear MM tries to resist this, I'm just a little frustrated I finally get my main (kassadin, try picking that in ranked ;_; ) and I managed to have one player single handedly throw the game (It was ~22 hours ago if you're checking match histories).

As a side note, it's great to hear riot addressing stuff like this, it's a good feeling to get a rely in some form or another.


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EpicSmurfAccount

Senior Member

02-08-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zileas View Post
OK I talked to Lyte about this. He theorizes that in this case you are likely dealing with one of two situations:

1) The person in question actually did play ranked last season, and has real experience -- and for whatever reason was playing poorly this game.

2) OR -- if #1 is not the case -- OCE is a smaller server than NA/EUW/etc, and it's possible the guy in question was in the queue for too long trying to get a 'low games played' game, and got tossed into yours after waiting a long time.

Basically, MM does try to resist this, but there are cases where it wont.
I don't start University until June, and I specifically play during the day (school days) here on the OCE server so I get matched with Gold-Plat+ because it boosts my MMR.


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Spreek

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

02-08-2014

@Zileas: Have you considered increasing the number of placement games that players completely new to ranked have to play?

I've spectated a number of my friends games in Silver and it's fairly common to see obviously new players who had lucky placements and got placed far above their actual skill level. Statistically, this will happen quite often with such a small sample of games (10).

Sure, these players will eventually drop down to where they belong (or quit ranked entirely out of frustration), but wouldn't it make more sense to have them play say 15 or 20 placement games in order to make an accurate first placement more likely. I know most implementations of the Elo system in Chess use 20 provisional games (For instance, the United States Chess Federation and FIDE), and chess is obviously not dependent on the skill of your teammates.


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LVNsNASmurf

Senior Member

02-08-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Varietoceraptor View Post
Hey, guy.

You're silver 5 with like 250 games played. 'New kids' are probably better than you most the time.
Dude, 250 games isn't exactly noob territory, give the guy a break. Silver can be very tough to carry or pull through because you can't just kill anyone who steps up to face you and win in that manner any more.


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Zileas

VP of Game Design

02-08-2014
4 of 4 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spreek View Post
@Zileas: Have you considered increasing the number of placement games that players completing new to ranked have to play?
That's something on the table for sure.

Quote:
I've spectated a number of my friends games in Silver and it's fairly common to see obviously new players who had lucky placements and got placed far above their actual skill level. Statistically, this will happen quite often with such a small sample of games (10).
We actually think it's pretty good, but are considering changing the number in future seasons to be either lower or higher -- there are merits to either approach (or maybe lower for returning people, higher for new people).