Ironstylus: "We're on track to release a VU every month or so."

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Super Explosion

Senior Member

02-02-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Oh, and the reason I don't talk about all of our planned relaunches is a) I don't want to set expectations because some of them are in early concept phase and they might very well be thrown out for one reason or another and b) we do want to preserve some sense of surprise when we can. Some relaunches will be discussed in depth because they're well known to be persistent issues in the game, visually, thematically and mechanically. The Sions, the Poppys, etc. But some aren't in need of such a protracted R&D phase that we can effectively keep them under wraps and bring people a nice fresh piece of content out of the blue.
Say, did you read my posts in the thread on that topic?

Basically, whether people get expectations or not tends to be mostly in how you phrase it.

If you're asking "does anyone like these concepts on [champion]", it may be pretty unlikely for people to expect that you're definitely going to do that.

I mean, regular updates with data-based reasoning on why design went one way or another may be a great way to the presumption of a guarantee.

My concern is first that you may consider some things 'minor enough to keep secret', but the metrics for that determination may not be clear, and especially in the case of reworks, you may miss out on useful data and testing discussions from the community.

There's basically something like 'feedback inertia'-- after a design has progressed a certain amount, feedback and discussion can become less impactful.

Perhaps "work's already been done" effect, basically.


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Spitƒire

Senior Member

02-02-2014

It's OK, Riot will be out of business in three months once Blizzard releases their MOBA.


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Hellioning

Senior Member

02-02-2014

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Originally Posted by Spitƒire View Post
It's OK, Riot will be out of business in three months once Blizzard releases their MOBA.
If DotA2 didn't sink them, HotS sure as hell won't.


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IronStylus

Sr. Concept Artist

02-02-2014
39 of 78 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Explosion View Post
Say, did you read my posts in the thread on that topic?

Basically, whether people get expectations or not tends to be mostly in how you phrase it.

If you're asking "does anyone like this concept on [champion]", it may be pretty unlikely for people to expect that you're definitely going to do that.

I mean, regular updates with data-based reasoning on why design went one way or another may be a great way to the presumption of a guarantee.

My concern is first that you may consider some things 'minor enough to keep secret', but the metrics for that determination may not be clear, and especially in the case of reworks, you may miss out on useful data and testing discussions from the community.

There's basically something like 'feedback inertia'-- after a design has progressed a certain amount, feedback and discussion can become less impactful.

Perhaps "work's already been done" effect, basically.
It's a big thread, unfortunately I haven't gotten to everything.

It'd be extremely difficult to give certain types of regular updates. It's just not feasible to do a day-to-day, nor is it a great idea to show off concepts or progress at different stages because it could all be thrown out, resulting in "The Omen Effect" (We throw something out for good reason, and.. "RITO, Y?!") I can guarantee, with each concept let's say, there will be an equal amount of people that like it or hate it. That's not going to make the decision any easier. You'd be astounded how intense discussions can get even internally. Breaking that open would be a little overwhelming.

What might be possible, is things like team members explaining where a certain character is at in it's pre-production, production, or post-production phase, but only if things are abundantly clear that at any point we could shift directions or that a release could be delayed or killed. Sometimes even the completion of content doesn't guarantee it's release.

Some of that is possible, some of it isn't. Also, I'll always throw in the caveat that we're only talking about an NA focused approach here. We have a property that's worldwide in it's reach. I'm not a data guy, but I would venture to guess that we should take a global approach to gathering feedback. That's one of the big reasons I'm not for polls and early concept reveals. Right now, due to the structure of our community, we can only effectively have the casual discussion (like this one) in a North American-centric venue. I don't think that's fair to the other territories, honestly.

You're right about feedback inertia, that's sometimes just the way it goes. We're not going to be able to make extreme changes on something past a certain point. That's why we're extremely deliberative in the early concept phase. It's a very delicate back and forth and a rigorous process of gut checks and review. At the same time, early exposure where we're at the most malleable phase as, again, some people will love a concept, others will hate it. Double edged sword. You no doubt see the conundrum.

It's a very tricky situation, one which I rack my brain about constantly in terms of how to address it properly. So, here I am, doing the best I can to explain what I can! Hopefully that counts for something.


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exec3

Senior Member

02-02-2014

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Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Giving the play-by-play isn't always productive or engaging. It's just work as usual.
Have you ever thought of doing a detailed play by play as it happens for some of the bigger ones like Sion so we can get a nice detailed and ongoing behind the scenes look of the process?


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Oragagashi

Senior Member

02-02-2014

Hey Iron, I'm curious on what you think of Malzahar's visuals/concept and if he is on the radar at all.


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Super Explosion

Senior Member

02-02-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Explosion View Post
If you're asking "does anyone like these concepts on [champion]", it may be pretty unlikely for people to expect that you're definitely going to do that.
So here's one potential example:

RiotPenguin's fan art thread. (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com...58148#41958148)

He's a concept artist working for Riot, posting on his official Riot account.

There's perhaps a ton of art for different potential skins.

Does the community expect those skins out? Nope!

Because RiotPenguin posted it as "fan art", just idle drawings about the game people may like.

Could any of those be actual official in-progress skin pieces of concept art? Probably.

So it's perhaps quite significantly how you phrase it.

"We're working on this cool new map called Magma Chamber! Get ready!"-- probably going to get expectations.

"I just did these fan art skins for fun."-- probably almost no expectations.

"Hey we're considering making Sion better, could you tell us what you think of this preliminary stuff?"-- expectation that you'll then tell us what happened in response to our feedback. Probably not that you'll do absolutely everything you mentioned in the thread.


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Orniphex

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Senior Member

02-02-2014

IRONSTYLUS! Hi :3 I figured you needed a break from serious things. Just wanted to say thank you for Leona and Diana and Quinn and ah I love you.


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5003

Member

02-02-2014

@ironstylus

What's the status on Evelynn? You guys said you would give her a VU sometime after her rework and she only received nerf after nerf. It's been a long time. Why hasn't there been any word on this? Can we expect anything?


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Oracles VS Teemo

Member

02-02-2014

Any word on Morgana's possible VU?