Undeath, Terror and Acid Hunters: Let's talk Urgot

First Riot Post
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Meddler

Lead Champion Designer

11-14-2013
1 of 8 Riot Posts

Hey all,

Urgot's a champion we haven't talked much about recently and one who's fallen out of sight after we reduced his power a while back. That's something we'd like to look at - reanimated undead monstrosity with powerful, heavy weapons and a mighty hatred's a cool concept that we're not doing justice at the moment. As a result we'll be doing some work on Urgot's kit next year, experimenting to find out what we need to do to preserve (or enhance) the cool aspects about him, while fixing the problems that lead us to nerfing him heavily in the past. That'll take a while, as a starting point though I thought it'd be great to get a bunch of thoughts from people on Urgot, both what he currently is and what he's got the potential to be.

If you play Urgot, what is it that appeals to you about him, both in terms of theme and gameplay? Which of his abilities define what it's like to play Urgot for you? If you don't play Urgot, are there particular reasons you're not interested in doing so?

When playing as Urgot are there things that feel unnecessarily difficult to do or ineffective? When playing against Urgot are there things that feel unfair?

General thoughts/comments also extremely welcome. One disclaimer though - at the moment at least we're only looking to work on Urgot's gameplay, not do a full overhaul of him, so while we'll assummedly give Urgot a visual upgrade at some point it'll be a separate, later project.


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Kaellrus

Senior Member

11-14-2013

I feel like Urgot's E has a very slow missile speed, but then again, being hit by it is very punishing.

The reasons why you wouldn't play Urgot would be he's ugly and because his kit seems a bit boring. I also feel like his ult isn't very rewarding because it has a high chance of also killing you. I think Urgot's shield should be given an AD ratio, and then he might also need a new passive/ult if you want him to be an ADC, otherwise, he probably needs other changes so that he's just a bully and not played as an anti-adc adc.


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LG Harmony

Senior Member

11-14-2013

I feel there's enough counterplay already - Hit with E, and Urgot gets a lot of damage to go through. Miss it, and you're not going to do much.

If ANYTHING should stay, it's the missile lock on.


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Glaricion

Senior Member

11-14-2013

I like how he is basically a monstrous fleshy orb in stilts. It reminds me of the dragoons(?) in StarCraft, and to me it shows 'how he looks on the inside', a disgusting and sadistic mess suffering from a great amount of anguish. As for gameplay, this means that he substitutes himself for another member of their team, and whilst they both end up suffering because of it, Urgot always ends up on top.

I feel as though his Q not being a walking cast is a bit clunky, they are called acid -hunters- so you expect them to just slide out, but they don't. They also seem to linger a bit too much on screen when rushing to an opponent effected by a corrosive charge. Also, with Urgot being weakenend and all, his whole “Sacrifice him and an opponent, but in the end coming out on top.” from his ult just doesn't happen. Playing against Urgot I cannot say that I remember the experience, it has been so long.

So basically, I see Urgot's theme as being a sick and demented person suffering eternally for his crimes due to being resurrected through strange means. His gameplay is all about making his opponents feel the same way he does:
1) slowly crippling his enemies in skirmishes and trades (charge > acid hunter spam)
2) sacrificing himself to gain an advantage for his team (trade your carry bruiser being out-of-position so that an enemy squishy can be taken out)

His passive is nice thematically, whilst his shield and armor reducing AoE dot is more of a nice added touch, rather than something that is all that important.

His Q's and his Ult are what make him, Q in skirmish and lane, R in the teamfight stage.


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Lajinn5

Senior Member

11-14-2013

Though I don't play Urgot, I have played against many and have seen somewhat what he's about. He seems to be an AD caster of sorts, who rather than relying on Autos will hit you with his acid bomb and stab you to death with homing missile knifes.

I don't think his shield really has any place in his kit however, it's negligible, and not very helpful when it comes to trading or just trying to survive. His ult could possibly use some tweaking as well, but that is something I'll stay away from, as Urgot players may like his ult. He could also possibly due with some AA range increase


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NeonSpotlight

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Senior Member

11-14-2013

Urgot, a champion analysis:

Kit defining mechanic: Lock-on Q

If there was any part of Urgot that definitely has to stay in order to make Urgot still feel like Urgot it's his lock-on barrage of Qs. You can change his ult, his passive and his W but the E > Q interaction is 90% of what and who Urgot is.

Playing as Urgot:

Pros

  • E into Q mechanic feels rewarding
  • Kit cohesion feels good most of the time
  • Stacking the odds against an enemy with your whole kit makes you feel powerful
  • Getting that perfect ult off on a priority target can be gamechanging
  • Sniping an enemy in the back line with a well aimed E>Q is rewarding
  • Outplaying potential with skillshots, shield and ult
  • Kit can be used as a back-line ad caster, a front line bruiser or an attack damage carry which gives you flexibility and options

Cons
  • A missed E, due to the long cooldown and reliance on it to do damage, can completely devastate you in a fight
  • Q without E and W feels like half of an ability unless you're point-blank
  • Armor shred and damage over time on E and passive's damage reduction are hard to notice
  • Ult feels weak most of the time and interrupts your flow, not to mention is easily interrupted
  • Decision between shredding front-line's armor or hitting back line for passive applying missile Qs
  • Kit can be used as a back-line ad caster, a front line bruiser or an attack damage carry leaving you confused as to how to best use your kit

Playing against Urgot:
Pros:
  • Outplay potential by dodging skillshots and abusing his reliance on landing E

Cons:
  • Lack of options if you get hit by E, either run out of range or get punished
  • Low CD on Q feels like Corki's ult pre-nerf, you're constantly being punished and dodging one doesn't mean much
  • Combination of passive, W and E stacking the deck makes any fight an uphill battle, even if you don't know it
  • Being constantly slowed from 1200 range never feels good
  • When Urgot was strong it made laning bot lane feel bad because he's such a huge bully

Suggestion:
Make Q stronger as a stand-alone ability, higher cooldown higher reward (like what happened to Eve's Q) so that it feels rewarding to hit without E. Make it so W and E are short duration strong steroids, make them feel good as a button press to strengthen his Q and autos without being an integral part of using it.

Reduce his unnoticed/invisible power and move that power into more visible parts of his kit. It's hard to feel that 20% AoE armor reduction or that 15% damage reduction is doing much or that your E is doing more than an Annie's W in terms of AoE damage because it's DoT. His power doesn't feel very visceral and makes him feel weaker than he really is.

His ult I don't have much to say other than the whole 120 armor/magic resist is huge late-game and is another thing that can be easy to overlook.

Closing:
Urgot's a very unique champion in the way he works and whether or not that's good or bad is something that has to be kept in mind. Would it be so bad to homogenize him a bit to smooth out those rough edges that make him so hard to balance? In my opinion he obviously isn't doing that well as he is now and those that were around for when he was strong know that he's kind of like Poppy in that when he's strong he feels bad to play against. Lowering his unique-ness some in favor of better balance-able aspects would probably be the best way to go at this point.


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Viktez

Member

11-14-2013

Currently I feel like Urgot just does not have the range to poke with Q and every time (Currently) it just isn't worth it as you can take a lot of punishment. That is one thing that put me off. His E is also very slow and feels unresponsive and has a short range to hit off which leads to more punishment for him walking up. He also needs a win mid game or it gets a lot harder to win.

However he has a very cool play-set and I love the plays you can make with his ultimate, great for when your jungle wants to gank. He just needs to be balanced in scaling so he can do more than just ulti late game.


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LG Harmony

Senior Member

11-14-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lajinn5 View Post
Though I don't play Urgot, I have played against many and have seen somewhat what he's about. He seems to be an AD caster of sorts, who rather than relying on Autos will hit you with his acid bomb and stab you to death with homing missile knifes.

I don't think his shield really has any place in his kit however, it's negligible, and not very helpful when it comes to trading or just trying to survive. His ult could possibly use some tweaking as well, but that is something I'll stay away from, as Urgot players may like his ult. He could also possibly due with some AA range increase
His shield is important because it gives the necessary slow Urgot needs to actually hit the enemy with multiple missiles.

The slow's attached to the shield because breaking it breaks the slow, or so i believe, though I haven't played Urgot in a long time so could be wrong.


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Morior Invictis

Senior Member

11-14-2013

I enjoy Urgot's lane bully presence that he brings by being able to poke from long distance while still being able to farm at the same time.

I find some of the issues with Urgot is that his ultimate is EXTREMELY situational as throwing your ADC/squishy bruiser into the middle of a teamfight requires huge communication and a proper team compositon to follow up on this. That communication is something you don't see in solo queue or normals, which is why Urgot was seen to do well professionally for a while, yet still underplayed/underperforming in the general population.

I find that Urgots Acid Hunter combination is an integral part of his kit, but both the slow/shield and his ultimate could take some looking at to either rework him as a complete ranged champion, or giving him some more tools to use while in close range to match his ultimate.

A lot of champions with engage abilites require a team to follow-up to be successful (malphite, J4, Nocturne etc.) but those champions can all be built as tanks so that they can survive being in that position. They are also not expected to be dealing big damage, but rather be disruptive.

With Urgot, you have to decide between dealing damage, or engaging and trying to flash away instantly to reposition, or accept that your life is worth your targets life. Urgot is given the role of diving an enemy team like your typical engage tanks, yet he isn't tanky enough to survive being in that situation, and it also hinders his damage potential.

I know that most of Urgot's builds require him to build tankier than your average ADC (Black Cleaver is core, items like Maw) so that he can survive his short range, but I just find that he suffers a similar issue that Quinn has in her Valor form. Identity Crisis. Urgot has some of the longest range ablities in the game, but also an ability that forces him into the enemy team in your typical teamfight.

Yes there are niche times when Urgot's ultimate is great, but I believe that those few times it is useful is worth less than the times I would rather play another champion who can perform his role, but better.

TL;DR

His lock on acid-hunters are what define Urgot.

Urgot's ultimate leads to identity crisis and needs some direction if he is to be a competitive choice amongst the general population and not just professionals.


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Azhliay

Senior Member

11-14-2013

The whole thing that was the most interesting about Urgot was watching his long range gameplay in S2. Gambit I think took Urgot Solo bot, and gave him a blue buff, and managed to steadfast the lane for a good 15 mins. The next patch Urgot received strong nerfs. And he hasn't been touched since then.

Urgot is a Ranged Anti Carry, who is meant to have a strong early game because of Acid Hunter, and his passive reducing damage. (That does work doesnt it?). He bullies incredibly hard, and resorts to building tank due to his AA range, and his Ultimate putting him in harms way.


The Reason I dont play Urgot?

Very hard to fit into most team comps, and have him be effective. He can slot into a few, but his role is limited. He needs something to make him more versatile than an Anti AD. I dont know what that is, but its a something.